Football

Good time to be a Sunderland fan, definitely...

Everton have been brilliant this half and sunderland have crumbled the Lukaku and Kone partnership is working well. Hope Pisti is enjoying it.

the cross by Lukaku for Kone 3rd was great.

Sound good. Perhaps Chelsea ought to make a move for him

Statto question. Have reigning premiership, or its antecedent leagues', champions ever been relegated?

Manchester City won the English league title in 1936-37 (with Manchester United relegated the same season). The next season Manchester City were relegated (with more goals scored than conceded!) and Manchester United were promoted.

Getting the champions relegated in the next season seems a Scandinavian specialty. It happened 4 times in Sweden, and 3 times in Finland, Norway and Denmark, who caught up in 2000/01. The Faroes also boast a case...

Algeria (2):
EP Sétif (champions 1987, relegated 1988)
USM El Harrach (champions 1998, relegated 1999)

Andorra (1):
Constel-lació Esportiva (champions 2000, relegated 2000) [1>

Austria (1):
FC Tirol Innsbruck (champions 2002, relegated 2002) [2>

Bolivia (1):
Universitario (La Paz) (champions 1969, relegated 1970)

Cameroon (1):
Aigle Nkongsamba (champions 1994, relegated 1995)

Chile (1):
Universidad Católica (champions 1954, relegated 1955) [3>

Denmark (3):
KB (champions 1950, relegated 1951)
Hvidovre (champions 1973, relegated 1974)
Herfølge BK (champions 2000, relegated 2001)

Dominican Republic (2):
Deportivo Pantoja (champions 2001, relegated 2002)
Baninter/Jarabacoa (champions 2003, relegated 2005) [no competition 2004>

Ecuador (1):
LDU (Quito) (champions 1999, relegated 2000)

England (1):
Manchester City (champions 1937, relegated 1938)

Faroe Islands (1):
B 71 (champions 1989, relegated 1990)

Finland (3):
Ilves-Kissat (champions 1950, relegated 1951)
TPV (champions 1994, relegated 1995)
Haka Valkeakoski (champions 1995, relegated 1996)

France (1):
Olympique Marseille (champions 1992, relegated 1994) [4>

Germany (1):
1.FC Nürnberg (champions 1968, relegated 1969)

Guinea Bissau (1):
UDIB (champions 2003, relegated 2004) [5>

Indonesia (2):
PSIS (Semarang) (champions 1999, relegated 2000)
Petrokimia Putra (Gresik) (champions 2002, relegated 2003)

Israel (2):
Hapoel Kfar-Saba (champions 1982, relegated 1983)
Hapoel Tel-Aviv (champions 1988, relegated 1989)

Italy (1):
Milan AC (champions 1979, relegated 1980) [6>

Jamaica (1):
Violet Kickers (champions 1996, relegated 1997)

Luxembourg (1):
Union Luxembourg (champions 1927, relegated 1928)

Malta (1):
Rabat Ajax (champions 1986, relegated 1987)

Mexico (1):
Marte (champions 1954, relegated 1955)

Netherlands (1):
RCH (champions 1953, relegated 1954)

Nigeria (2):
Stationery Stores (champions 1992, relegated 1993) [7>
Shooting Stars (champions 1998, relegated 1999)

Norway (3):
Freidig (Trondheim) (champions 1948, relegated 1949)
Fram (Larvik) (champions 1950, relegated 1951)
SK Brann (champions 1963, relegated 1964)

Poland (1):
Ogniwo Bytom (champions 1954, relegated 1955) [8>

San Marino (1):
La Fiorita (champions 1990, relegated 1991)

Sweden (4):
Helsingborgs IF (champions 1934, relegated 1935)
GAIS (champions 1954, relegated 1955)
Djurgårdens IF (champions 1959, relegated 1960)
IFK Göteborg (champions 1969, relegated 1970)

Uzbekistan (1):
MHSK Tashkent (champions 1997, relegated 1998)

Vietnam (1):
Cang Saigon (champions 2002, relegated 2003)

Wales (1):
Barry Town (champions 2003, relegated 2004)

[1> Constel-lació were relegated (and suspended for seven years) for
alleged bribe attempts and financial irregularities, not because
they finished on a relegation spot.
[2> FC Tirol Innsbruck were refused a professional license and
relegated two levels because of financial problems and not because
they finished on a relegation spot; at the moment of their relegation
they had won the Austrian league championship three times in succession.
[3> After the shock relegation of Universidad Católica, the rules were
adapted and relegation was decided on performances over more than
just the last season. Universidad Católica profited from this in
1960, when they finished last but Magallanes was relegated instead of
them. They then proved to really belong in the top division in the
most convincing manner, winning the title in 1961 (and reaching the
title playoff in 1962).
[4> Marseille were stripped of the 1992/93 championship following a bribery
scandal (the title was not awarded at all) and were relegated as a
punishment in 1993/94 at a time they were the last team to have won
the championship (legally) in 1991/92.
[5> UDIB were relegated after failing to show for their first two matches
in the 2004 season.
[6> Milan were relegated because of a bribery scandal involving their
championship season and not because they finished on a relegation
spot.
[7> Stationery Stores were relegated because of failing to complete
their fixtures, not because they finished on a relegation spot.
[8> Ogniwo was the temporary name of Polonia Bytom, who later merged
with Szombierki Bytom.

EP Sétif's relegation was all the more shocking because they went on to win the African Champions' Cup (for which they had qualified as Algerian champions 1986/87) at the end of 1988, becoming continental champions as a second division club!

KB were Danish champions in 1948, 1949 and 1950, were relegated in 1951, won promotion in 1952, and won the championship again in 1953 - six eventful seasons...

Haka had an eventful six-year sequence in Finland: champions 1995, relegated 1996, promoted 1997 (and winning the cup as a second division team!), and champions 1998, 1999 and 2000, but they failed to emulate ÍA's feat of five consecutive titles after promotion.

SK Brann were Norwegian champions twice before going down in 1964: they won the Norwegian league both in 1961/62 and 1963 - and since they were relegated in 1959/60 and promoted in 1960/61, they had a series of 5 very eventful seasons. They also had a remarkable 8-season series from 1979 to 1986: going down, going up, going down...

Another team who had been champions twice before getting relegated is Helsingborgs IF: Swedish champions in 1932/33 and 1933/34, they went down in 1934/35 and needed two seasons to bounce back.

Moreover, LDU from Quito were champions of Ecuador in 1998 and 1999 before suffering relegation on the final day of the Clausura 2000.

Finally, Jarabacoa had been champions of the Dominican Republic (as Baninter) in 2001 and 2002/03 (the first two editions of the Liga Mayor) before being relegated in 2004/05 (the third edition). Apart from KB, Brann and Haka, the only other team to have both been crowned champions immediately following promotion and relegated as champions is Fram (Larvik).

Whereas 1964, 1998 and 2003 saw 4 promoted teams winning their domestic league, in 1951 three Nordic champions went down (KB, Ilves-Kissat and Fram (Larvik)), while 1955 (Marte, Universidad Católica, Polonia Bytom and GAIS) saw four reigning champions relegated.

Finland is the only country which had reigning champions relegated in consecutive years.

Nigeria had both its champions relegated and a newly promoted team crowned champions in 1999! The same happened in Vietnam and in Indonesia in 2003, before the Dominican Republic joined their company in 2005.

Manchester City's relegation was all the weirder because they scored more goals in 1937/38 than any other English first division club and had a positive goal difference.

All from http://www.rsssf.com

I know Marseille got dumped down the divisions but that was for match fixing, champions 92 divison 2 1993.
well there you go ^ City have.

jaw
This of exactly how I like my Liverpool fans. Confident, cocky, mouthy and full of hope. Only to forget that they've won jack all other than a fluked CL for ten years.

Can't wait for their bubble to burst and hear about how next season is going to be their season in a few months time.

Do your jose song...you know the one about how he is one of your own and does what he wants....

Jaw, do you sing songs about your own club as vociferously as those of other players or clubs?

I'm not suggesting we are going to win anything or finish anywhere. I'm really happy to see incremental improvements in individual players and the overall team. I'd bet everything I own that the squad's upturn is due to getting simplified instruction. No seconds wasted trying to process new info and working out what to do- something it appears United players are suffering under Aloysius Paulus Maria "Louis" van Gaal. I think Brendan was guilty of over thinking and trying to show the world his amazeballz footie acumen.

It's just nice to watch without several questions ringing in your head at the team selection and/or the line up before the game's even kicked off. I like that he wants to recall all loanees back, assess what is in the pantry before the talk of going shopping. He wants them to understand exactly how he wants to play. I'm glad he's seen things the way many of us saw them: it is not the terrible squad many of you suggested it and NO, we do not need a rebuild, just a rejig and one or two buys: Left back cover and a winger maybe and a DM. Christ, Lucas is like a new man now the ball recovery duty has been spread throughout the team.

I like that our manager doesn't disrespect the opposition or do the petulant toy throwing routine. Though the way the media have turned on him despite his fantastic trophy haul is distasteful. His first struggles and this?! (If this is what you meant @Chalfie about patience then I agree.)

(I also like the fact we've contributed to that shithouse manager getting the boot. Only thing sweeter would be wenger being the one to give him the bullet.)

The greatest of days so far. HH for the first time with the kids in the morning. A battering of the stylish ones in the afternoon.

I was there with mine too. Didn't see you (obv) - shout if you're going again next week. Were usually there.

^ won't discuss football though.

Must say I really enjoyed taking her up the Arse for the Bayern game. Must do it again sometime.

I always tend to have two tickets for sale at the Emirates if you ever want to go.

Did you take her up the Oxo Tower afterwards?

I made it for the 1-2 toddler frog bike sessions. I shall put a picture up in the mums and dads thread.
Jack really enjoyed it but it took almost 2 hours to drive there from North London so not sure I will do it every Saturday but definitely once in a while

Small steps, Joseph, small steps.

@Stonehedge Thanks for that. Her mate is also a season ticket holder.

@mikec, the train from north London to HH is pretty convenient. You're in East Finchley right? Cricklewood or Hendon are direct to HH.

I know Imogen would be up for some track time too, let's all meet up.

@mikec - ah, that's later on isn't it. Mine are at the morning sessions. (Thankfully moving to the winter hours from Sat - extra hour in bed).

Link to the highlights of Saturdays game should assist some of the Chelsea fans in apportioning blame for the defeat

http://www.fullmatchesandshows.com/2015/10/31/chelsea-vs-liverpool-highlights-full-match-2/

I might look into that train. Though it's always tricky with 2 kids two bikes/scooter and one adult on public transport!

Villa look to have dodged a Brodgers-shaped bullet. Apparently they're getting a TV pundit in to manage them...

I cannot help but notice that Sherwood and Garde look like they could be brothers

Villa look to have dodged a Brodgers-shaped bullet. Apparently they're getting a TV pundit in to manage them...

Better than a know-nothing, fucknugget chancer.

I think most Arsenal fans have fond memories of Garde as a player. He was reliable and accepted his role (back up to Vieira and Petit) with good grace.

He did a good job at Lyon, hopefully he'll do the same for you.