Rapha, nice but a bit pricey?

Mamil toe.

The PTSS is softshell all over, not just the leading panels so is for wet weather.

With the PTJ you still need a rain jacket or race-cape over the top if you're in prolonged rain or heavy showers.

The SS only comes in two colours so it's like you've saved 50% already.

Mamil toe

ha ha ha, very good !!

Is there something on eBay I'm missing?

I believe the term is 'moose knuckle'

Yes, sorry, I think that's what I meant. The jacket/ss difference. The PT stuff seems like a good option for 'fast' riding, but are we talking about really pushing it at fitness thresholds, or just being faster than all the other commuters on your way to work?

Edit: Because I'm definitely in the latter camp, apart from the very rare occasion when I have some time away from't bairn.

Their finishing does seem a little off on quite a few products. For example a pair of pro team gloves i ordered recently had loose stitching when out of the bag. They'll go back.

The odd thing is you can even spot a lot of finishing problems on the item photographs on the website if you look closely; such as loose or wonky stitching, and unfinished edges to the fabrics sticking out, fabric not trimmed to make seams neat etc. Seems odd that they'd use them as the couple of photos you get an idea of the product and finishing from before you order.

truth. don't get me wrong, i've got a hardshell jacket which is great and survived a few crashes pretty much unscathed, and their merino boxer shorts are the comfiest underwear i've ever tried, but the quality doesn't seem to extend across the whole range unfortunately, whereas with other brands they seem to take more care over it.

Anyone interested in a worn once XS brevet jersey in blue (SS, no gilet) ?

Is it a women fit again?

Which colour makes you go fastest?

Orange. Definitely the orange.

^^^ nope!

Good job that's the one I've got then.

Applying some common sense; the stuff in the shoots is probably prototype stuff which gets shot months before the actual garmants are delivered from Portugal/ China.

Surely a one off prototype would be finished to a higher level of quality than a mass produced garment? A prototype is, and should be, the purest example of the product you wish produced.

I have a menswear business selling hand made clothing myself and as far as I'm concerned the finishing is truly awful (especially for the price charged). I'm not the only one to point this out, another member here who said his gf worked in fashion said she complained of exactly the same things.

At the end of the day not many people know what they're looking at when it comes to finishing standards in clothing but if you're in the trade yourself, it's appalling.

Don't get me wrong, it's not a rant and I'm a Rapha fan boy, but it's one area they really need to improve.

Surely a one off prototype would be finished to a higher level of quality than a mass produced garment? A prototype is, and should be, the purest example of the product you wish produced.

The point of prototypes is to find things that need changing. So there can be many imperfect prototypes before one is signed-off. In theory the production run should replicate that final prototype exactly.

In my experience it's quite common for photo shoots to go ahead with a prototype/pre-production example (as @dan says usually due to time constraints).

I'm not saying its OK for there to be defects by the way, just that it might explain visible ones in shots. Really those things should be retouched.

Can you provide a link to your menswear business?

As I work mostly for individual clients it's easier to see the sort of things I sell here. As you can see practically everything is hand made or finished so I'm not just spouting an uneducated opinion.

http://ichdien.tumblr.com

Rapha prototypes, tasty but a bit hasty.

It's a bit odd comparing bespoke clothing with mass-produced sportswear.

Oh look, this Saville Row suit is better made than a Nike windjacket... Nike are shit.

I didn't read "Rapha is shit" anywhere.

I ad-lib'd from appalling