Coffee Appreciation

Again for Berliners...
...been to the barn a few times now and much impressed.

Coffee (espresso) was very good every time, people very nice, atmosphere nice and calm.
Cakes smelled really delishious too; alas not vegan..
Also their prices are really ok (2.40 for double espresso - other "hyped" roasters in that area charge 3.50).

@tiki I'm in Berlin this weekend, will be staying around Lichtenberg (according to Google Maps), anything good in the locality?

Wait that seems to be a pretty big area, I'll narrow it down. Victoriastadt?

anything good

That's not really my area; the closest one I have heard good things about to where you are is Silo - https://www.facebook.com/silocoffee

That looks ideal, will probably only have time to check one or two out so will definitely go there - breakfast looks good - and one other place you've recommended.

It kind of depends on how you define ‘appreciation’

I don’t particularly relate to the ‘hallowed bean’ school of thought, that you must follow a process that allows you to identify all the flavour profiles. Those flavour profiles are affected by trends and tastes. I think coffee appreciation is much wider than this and operates outside just a 'flavour wheel’ parameter.

Sometimes I appreciate a dark as sin ristretto, sometimes I appreciate a cold water process, sometimes I appreciate a spot on flat white.

The other thing I don’t particularly agree with is the school of thought that home espresso machines can’t deliver - I’d love it to be the case that every coffee shop I walked to served me an espresso or flat white like I get at Notes but I’d say that even in the indie coffee shops with trained baristas I’m getting a decent coffee about 60% of the time.

At home I’ve got time to temp surf, weigh every shot, concentrate on stretching the milk etc. However well trained the baristas are pressures of volume, time and sometimes pure ‘can’t be arsed’ means that a good deal of the time I can make a better coffee at home than I will get in a coffee shop

I am normally too precious with coffee. That said, I am currently drinking a McDonalds coffee and am going to wash it down with an instant just to spite @Lukemdfree who I hope is young, tender, and free from life experience.

Its not too bad, I put milk and sugar in it.

Wait this is like when @EdwardZ ruined the Leather shoes thread.
Or when jeeze ruins the football thread.

If I wanted to read what whoppers think I'd just type Pisti into the search.

much #rep

did LOL

If I wanted to read what whoppers think I'd just type Pisti into the search.

I was unfamiliar with 'whopper' in this context. It means a lot of different things, apparently.

#ruinazinger

It's like when my friend's brother called me a 'spoon' once.

#iamaspoon #lukemdfreeisawhopper

[UPDATE: It is possible I am a whopper as well.]

#rep for big_daddy_wayne and arrowplum and Tenderloin

+1 for @big_daddy_wayne... Not to mention - you make really excellent coffee, and I'm not blowing smoke up your arse because you're a mate. I can only think of a handful of places which have served me better coffee on a regular basis, than you do pretty much every time I pop by.

I can sort of see where you're coming from @Lukemdfree but saying that £9-12 is what you should spend on coffee is disingenuous when you can spend £6-7.50 on some really excellent coffee from Square Mile, Climpsons, Hasbeen etc.

Like a loser fanboi I like to buy whatever The Fields Beneath have leftover in their £5 white label bags every 2 weeks.

Sorry, late reply. Getting a v60 has pretty much killed all use of my aeropress use (and most other home brew methods with the exception of a cafetiere for cold brewing). It helps that I like lighter roasts and naturals and I think they suit a v60.

Sorry I'm not in your club guys, it's really too bad I started my foray into the forum the way I did, because you automatically dismiss my opinion. You all have very strong opinions, and act like a bunch of teenagers who are scared of being wrong.

Literally nobody really challenged any of the facts I suggested, but decided to call me out on my manner, and I guess fair enough.

I'm glad you think you can make a good espresso at home, and you can probably beat most indie coffee shops, because people in London still mostly don't even know a thing about espresso brew ratios, and a lot of people are pulling salty under extracted ristrettos.

If you can forgive my abruptness to begin with, please I encourage you to seek out more information from the businesses I mentioned earlier.

There is a lot of new coffee businesses in London, and they all have an opinion of what to do, some are being more methodical and scientific in their approach, while some are sticking to tradition or heresay. I believe in the scientific approach.

Go on spiting me if you think it will make you feel better, but id rather have a good(note, better then you have had before as an ongoing process) coffee making you feel better.

Edit:
To me it's about as simple as tasting them side by side and comparing things. I dare you to cup climpsons vs workshop for example. Obviously brewing makes a difference, but it's such a small little piece in the system, it starts at the farm mannnnn

The more good coffee you buy, the more they make, the cheaper it gets.

So you want us all to buy the most expensive coffee to make it cheaper for you?

I get coffee at trade/cost/for free.

No offense, but how about you just chill out a bit?

I'm sure you have a lot to add to the thread and it's cool you take it seriously and all,
it maybe just came across as if you're trying to disabuse.

Bwahaha I'm cracking up at you lot man man. I could never enjoy something if I was this cerebral about it. Sure passion is fine but there's some militant shit up in here. People getting all butt hurt over coffee.

Ok Luke - I'll engage

The fundamental flaw, for me, on your theories about coffee is that you are positing that there is a singular, scientific procedure to producing the very best coffee.

The problem with that theory is you're applying a quantitive [science of making coffee] to a qualititive/subjective [dictates of personal taste]

Just because you think a process or a roaster makes the perfect coffee doesn't make that assumption correct, and inflexibility inhibits discovery

Now if you rock up and say 'dude, I've found this awesome roaster and I've been having a crack at it and try it at this grind, this water temp' then it's game on for me, happy to try something new.

If your recommendations are based on a dismissal of other methods or opinions then I'll do what I'd do with any other fundamentalist, and ignore it.

I'm sure you've got some great insights and opinions - but share, don't preach, be willing to be proved wrong