Police spotting (junction watch)

There's works going on at the marble arch cycle exit of Hyde park, there were police fining any cyclsts this morning who exited onto the footpath to the crossing without dismounting.

police scouting out where upper street and Islington green meet this morning, fines going out for pavement riders.

Police at Waterloo roundabout this morning. I watched one driver in the middle lane with no other car or cyclist close, stop about a metre into the ASL. The Police Officer stepped straight out and ticketed him. It brightened my journey up a touch.

Glad some of them somewhere are enforcing the law equally.

is it the law?

/paging doctor schick...

What were the 4 cop vans and the wandering coppers doing around HAC on City Road last night? Expecting an anti-war protest or something?

What were the 4 cop vans and the wandering coppers doing around HAC on City Road last night? Expecting an anti-war protest or something?

There was an anti-fracking demo at Bunhill Row side of HAC going on yesterday afternoon. Not sure if anything was going on at the City Road side. They'd all buggered off by the time I left work at 6 though.

They're fracking on Bunhill Row?

is it the law?

/paging doctor schick...

Is what the law? Not running red? Yeah, don't think you need Shick LLD for that.

asl occupation.

Yeah mate it's the same offence as running a red.

For the car, the "red line" is the first one before the ASL and for a bike it's the second. I.e. if it's yellow and they can stop before ASL, but stop in it, they've technically committed an offence. Both are punishable under "not following traffic signals" or similar.

This is so poorly known and understood, and the po po don't give a shit*, hence confusion such as yours.

*Dalston yesterday, panda car stops full within ASL despite plenty of time to slow on yellow. I was going to have a word but had no proof so instead passively-aggressively sat in front of them right on the forward line. Yeah. I showed them.

from here

Myth Busting

Myth: There’s a car in the ASL box - the driver must have committed an offence.

Not true. The offence is committed when the vehicle enters the ASL box when the light is red. If the vehicle enters the box and the light changes to red, no offence is committed

Rule 178 of the Highway Code states:
If your vehicle has proceeded over the first white line at the time that the signal goes red, you MUST stop at the second white line, even if your vehicle is in the marked area.

We don’t want motorists to wrongly believe that they shouldn’t stop in the ASL box under any circumstances – this might cause someone to panic, drive through a junction and cause an accident.

patronise much?

Nah - from that link "If the traffic light changes from green to amber and you cannot safely stop before the first stop line, you may cross the line but must stop before the second stop line (Highway Code rule 178)."

You're still obliged to stop at the first line, if safe to do so, on yellow or red, and not doing so is an offence.

The met are simplifying it because it's a relatively new thing and so few people understand anyway.

"178

Advanced stop lines. [...]Motorists, including motorcyclists, MUST stop at the first white line reached if the lights are amber or red
**Laws RTA 1988 sect 36 & TSRGD regs 10, 36(1) & 43(2)"

**Those offences (RTA 36, etc) are the same as for running a normal red.

the vagueness of the law and it's susceptibility to circumstance means the enforcing of asl's is effectively done on an ad hoc basis.

suffice to say if yer man who got ticketed will most likely get out of it if he decides to challenge it in court.

Yeah, unless the copper is willing to attest they saw all parts of the offence (i.e. were watching as the car approached and the lights changed), which will normally do as evidence.

Obviously they should just enforce it using camera with ANPR as per yellow box junctions, red lights, etc. It's a simple modification to the existing tech and it's harder to spot a camera than a copper so motorists would have to behave. A bit.

The law is actually no vaguer or harder to enforce than for non-asl red light infractions. And they issue plenty tickets for that!

what they should do is get the fuck rid of ASL's entirely. the way they are engineered (and i use that term loosely) encourages ppl on bikes to be in the least safe part of a junction imaginable.

Hmm

Where would you have us?

I don't think they're a perfect solution but I think it's better than getting caught alongside an accelerating/turning vehicle.

Actually I suppose ideal would be bikes being treated as traffic, so when there's a queue you stop at your place in primary. But neither cyclists nor drivers are anywhere near that mental state yet...

if you're going to have ASL's, at least make them filter centrally, a good example of this is on the A3 clapham road where it joins the clusterfuck around stockwell station, and even then, they need to be coupled with advance lights for cyclists.

look familiar?

Ah yes. Safest place to filter/overtake is on the right, but most ASLs can only be legally entered from the left... A lot of roads it just doesn't work any other way. E.g. whitechapel high st x cambridge heath road, there's a long central entry to the ASL but because of the size of the lanes + cyclists usually using the left route in means it's always full of car bus and lorry.

Consistency would be better so people would at least know where to expect other road users. ^ cabs need re-designed. totally inappropriate for city use and also presumably not very aero.

i would suggest banning HGV's from the CBD during peak hours entirely and of course, investing in some non paint-based infrastructure.

Police at Waterloo roundabout this morning. I watched one driver in the middle lane with no other car or cyclist close, stop about a metre into the ASL. The Police Officer stepped straight out and ticketed him. It brightened my journey up a touch.

Rode around a guy who parked his dealer 'fresh BMW square in teh middle of every ASL down gt.Western road in Glasgow a few days back.

At about the 6th set of lights I pulled infront as I was turning right and its a nasty junction, needed to get the drop! Told the guy his new bike looked a bit funny, probably too many wheels to be a bike, he took it in good humour and genuinely didn't know what the box was about, so not all bad.

Lewisham. Two days running now, loads of plod. Morning and evening. Junction of Courthill Road and the A21 with many more at the bottom of Loampit Vale and a few at the crossing by the station. I head in too late for the nodder rush so no idea if they're after cyclists or something else.