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I used a 1950's Raleigh as my commuter and it was hard work (especially in the summer) as there were a few hills on the way. Going slow/relaxed didn't make much difference, it was still harder work than my road bike so therefore a more sweat inducing experience.
The only reason I used it was because it had full guards (including chain case) so was good for riding with work suit and shoes on..

Did you try the road bike in your work suit as well?

The thing here is that some have more will power/control than others I guess. A bike will never encourage me to ride faster than I want to. Difficult for people in one position to appreciate those in the other...

It's more subtle than that. A bike (/car/skis/shoes/whatever) can't make you ride faster than you want to but it can make you want to ride faster.

Let's say the lights go green when you are about 200 yards away. If you carry on at the speed you're going you'll get there just as they change again and have to wait out the cycle. If you're taking it slow on a nippy bike you know you can accelerate just a teeny bit and you'll catch the lights and be happily on your way. On a roadster you know you might be able to make it, but it'll be a lot of effort and there's a good chance you'll have to stop anyway so chances are you'll not bother. In fact you'll see that light change and start slowing. Over a trip, those little bursts of acceleration add up to working that little bit harder to go that little bit faster on the road bike.

Of course, the more convinced someone is that they aren't susceptible to outside influences, the less likely they are to recognise them.

Here is a (bad) mosaic of a facepalm made up of many facepalms to express just how fuken dumb the vast majority of posts in this thread are:

http://i.cr3ation.co.uk/dl/s1/jpg/facepalm.jpg

yo dawg etc.

That would be all the posts from people who know everything about the difference between riding a light road bike and a heavy dutch/roadster bike even though they've never tried it, right?

Funny how the people who have tried both say one thing and the people who haven't are telling them they are wrong.

Yeah I agree, I've been loaned a Bobbin Bike (big cumbersome Pashley type bike) for a couple of days and it is SO unstable and heavy! If I was a newb to cycling having such an unpredictable and annoying bike would definitely not help soothe my nerves when in the middle of rush hour traffic. Filtering must be pretty much impossible. Let alone getting any momentum up hills.

On a bike like that I wouldn't bother trying to filter. It's a different style of riding - slower and laid back, and of course drivers tend to give you more space.

YMMV but I find it a lot less fraught taking this approach in the rush hour.

The best way to encourage women to cycle is getting out there and being a woman who cycles

The hair, clothes and makeup problem is a blocker for a lot of women, so a bit less emphasis on SCR and a bit more on it being perfectly possible to cycle 5 miles or so to work without getting sweaty, or to pop to the shops without wearing a clown suit.

Access to repair services to sort out punctures etc - either more lbses or some sort of AA for bikes. Not because we can't do it but because we don't want every trip to come with added risk of oily hands. Especially if we're on a bike with a chaincase.

And one from the wishful thinking list, a cultural shift to treating aggressive driving by the WVMs and cabbies of this world with the same disgust shown to someone taking a dump in the street would help no end.

No, it's working just fine.

To reduce exertion, you therefore want to reduce weight: carry as little as possible, and for the bicycle itself to weigh as little as possible.

Reducing exertion in the context of this thread, is to try to avoid sweating. .

If the problem is how to go at the same speed but sweat less then yes it'll have to be a lighter bike (and panniers), but that wasn't the problem. The guy's issue isn't excessive sweat at normal riding speeds, it's that he can't ride in a relaxed way.

Riding a bike that encourages slow but smooth riding by its geometry, weight and unwieldyness is going to mean this rider sweats less.

I'm not sure riding a light-weight city bike would be the best of both worlds since the smooth, relaxed riding style and safe, solid feeling of a roadster comes in part from its weight. The weight punishes stop-starty cycling and rewards smooth, realxed cycling.

When I started cycling someone told me a road bike was the best sort of bike for London. It was the worst piece of cycling advice I've ever got!

Did you switch in Autumn?

Nope, spring about 2 years ago. 6 mile commute with no need to shower at work in any season

I switched from a 531 tourer to a vintage roadster. The roadster is heavier than the tourer. I sweat less on the roadster.

Anyone who thinks you must sweat more on a heavy upright bike than a lightweight road bike haven't tried it.

http://dadsaretheoriginalhipster.tumblr.com/post/17273136702/your-dad-rode-vintage-road-bikes-before-you-did

"...when you’re saddle deep in 70’s street style that you’ve ruined by converting it into a fixie with obnoxiously neon velocity wheels, remember this… That bike was the only thing your dad rode harder than the Tour de Your Mom."

1. Most bike accidents are the cyclists' fault ---- skydancer's link to Pedal cyclist collisions and casualties in Greater London doc (sorry, I can't see how to make a short link)
   

I agree with this. People are at fault for being selfish, their mode of transport has no bearing on this.

True. Their mode of transport does however have a bearing on how much damage they can do.
Equivalent fail <> equivalent outcome

Been saying this for years.

Fluoronodders look like outcasts and are easy to identify as such.

Yup. I wear a flowery dress for cycling; it does far more for my safety than a helmet.

This may not work as well for men.

1. Cyclist don't pay road tax
   
2. Riding a bike is dangerous
   
3. All cyclists jump red lights
   
4. Pavement cycling is dangerous and evil
   
5. Cyclists must use cycle lanes where they're safer
   
6. The best way to be safe is to wear a helmet
   
7. Cycle training is only for n00bs ;)
   
8. Cyclists should keep to the left out of the path of cars
   
9. It's OK for motorists to stop in a cyclist ASL
   
10. Cyclists should get registration plates, insurance and licences
    
11. Cyclists should be made to wear lycra and day glo jackets
    
12. Most bike accidents are the cyclists' fault
    
13. Badly ridden bicycles present the same threat as badly driven cars
    

Eleanor Mills: "Every time you get on a bicycle and whizz off down a road you dice with death."

That says more about her lack of roadcraft than anything else

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/public/cyclesafety/article3309168.ece

"Rattling along a main road on a bike older than my mother, with no helmet or reflective jacket. Hundreds of cars whip past. In most British cities, this would be a death wish. In Copenhagen, it is travelling to work"

FFS. That's how I get to work safely in London. Old bike, bobble hat, big hand signals, six miles, big grin. It's hardly a death wish - most London drivers are very courteous to a slow moving lady on a bike. If she'd tried it she'd know that - instead she's just reinforcing what "everybody knows" about how dangerous cycling is.

Initially I thought the complaints earlier in the thread were a bit gift-horse, but when the campaign page features a lot of danger-focussed headlines, together they give a very misleading impression about cycling in London. The reality is that last year hundreds of thousands of us *weren't *killed or injured.

Technically...
we wouldn't have any road accidents if it was that simple

I wanna live in a world where the rigid look after the squishy

To that end I will ride stupid slow if there is any chance a ped will get under my wheel before I can stop

That means it takes me c10 mins extra to get to work than it would if I rode like everyone else's job is to get out of my way

I am ok with that

I remember now, after it was diagnosed as non-union I did see a private consultant about whether to get it pinned. He said since I have full movement he didn't recommend it because if the join is too strong (ie held together with metal) and I had a similar fall in future the impact would be forced into my shoulder which is a harder injury to heal. Between snowboarding and mountainboarding we decided there was a reasonable risk of more heavy falls in future so it would be better to leave it flexy (though as it turned out my next injury happened washing up)

i broke mine about 8 years ago - clean break which was treated with a sling but it didn't join up so now I have a lump where the end of the bone pokes up. It springs up and down which is a good party drink to make people go ewwwww

I decided not to get it pinned and although I'm aware of it sometimes it doesn't cause any real problems. I find the muscles behind the shoulderblade on that side get tired so I need to to rotate / click the joint to ease them, but that's as much to do with working at a screen all day for 15 years as it is the injury. When I could be bothered to go to the gym I found Body Pump classes helped - I assume it's the high rep + low weights

re: racks over the front wheel in general.

I genuinely don't understand what's so functional about these.....

Everyday riding: it's somewhere to put handbag + coat and have them in easy reach

Fully laiden riding: it's extra load area when the rear rack and side baskets are full.

Low riders wouldn't work for me because I never found panniers practical. You have to have them with you all the time just in case you need them, then you have to either remove them when you stop or worry about them being nicked. When you finally do need to use them they are never the right size.

My setup is intended for large items and shopping bags - apart from the racks on the bike I just need to carry a couple of bungies and a cargo net.

Still a risk of overhang tho...

...what about a p-clip halfway up the front right handside strut to create the equivalent of the brazeon mount?

That's how mine is fixed:

basically, a long bolt, a handful of nuts and washers, a cut off heavy duty rawl plug for a spacer, a p-clip and some old inner tube.

My functional bike. Definitely functional. Definitely not porn.

It's not the same as this one http://oldbike.wordpress.com/1910-raleigh-ladies-light-weight-no-17-bicycle/ but very similar - I have a 1930s ladies raleigh and yours looks more like the 1910 one than it does mine

I'm pretty sure wearing a flowery dress keeps me safer than wearing a helmet

Sorry guys, they've been collected

50mm ITM quill stem, very scratched at the bottom but plenty of life in it.
Clamp size is 24.5 mm (not 25.4 mm).

Handlebars made of veryheavyium and painted with finest hammerite. Were stoker bars from a 1940s tandem but I used them just as handlebars.

To collect from N15 near Seven Sisters tube.

Liz

Has anyone in N15/N4/N16 area got a half-link they don't need that I can collect tonight / tomorrow morning? Will pay a quid or so either to you or charity of your choice.

Many thanks
Liz