Unusual italian track frame, value?

Hi,

I'm thinking about buying a frame, but I can't get much information from the seller.

Could anyone help identifying this one? And - what's it worth?

The only known info is:

• Gipiemme track dropouts, chrome, with one chrome chainstay

• Italian flag, raised/embossed on top tube (but slanted, not rectangular like Ciocc/Concorde)

• Has a Columbus SPX decal on the seat tube, but of course I do not know if it is genuine?

• Never seen that before: some of the joints are lugged, the rest (steerer and also around BB/seattube) is either TIG or fillet brazed, I don't know, looks too smooth for TIG but not smooth enough for fillet brazing?

I would be absolutely amazed if anyone can tell me a bit more about it.

IMAGES: http://www.flickr.com/photos/52750795@N02/

thanks,
jetski

the lug/brazing combo is rather strange.
almost a bit suspicious.

Looks like a decently made but fairly heavy gauge 'training' frame - looks like the builder used some pretty standard lugwork to attach the BB shell and seat stays to the seat cluster - I would say not SPX, although it looks fairly well put together and solid - all depends on the price...

Looks like a decently made but fairly heavy gauge 'training' frame - looks like the builder used some pretty standard lugwork to attach the BB shell and seat stays to the seat cluster - I would say not SPX, although it looks fairly well put together and solid - all depends on the price...

It's £135

How do you spot the heavy gauge-ness? Wouldn't that fit to SPX?

you can easily tell if its SPX by sticking your finger in the seattube - I just suspect its heavier gauge tubing beacuse of the lack of lugwork and welding.

Sounds like good money to me

Yeah I'd defininety drop 135 on it

From the flag on the top tube I'm pretty sure it's a Concorde .. It also looks like a road frame that's been butched as the track drop outs just don't look right. If it is SPX that was for Columbus tubing for professional cyclists therefore wouldn't you expect a professional finish to the track drop outs where they join the tubes? .. that's my 2 pence

Okay, but in this case you would not go and have all the hassle to chrome the chainstays, wouldn't you? And you probably would not use Gipiemme ends but just any random ones.
Also, the frame seems to be not drilled at the rear brake?

I've seen that Italian flag on bikes from many different Italian manufacturers do don't see why that makes it a Concorde.

It looks well made to me and, for £135, a very good price.

I was just told two more measurements by the seller: BB is 70mm Italian threading (ok), but the seatpost diameter is 26.8 which renders it impossibly to be a SPX, right?

135 still good? not so sure anymore

Seller measured again and said that the seatpost diameter is actually 27.0, which would be correct for SPX... buy or not buy?

Send me the seller's details, I'd like to have a little chat with him... ;]

magnus - is it the right size for you? and do you have the money?

If the answer to both is yes, go back to the seller, point out the above, and say you're not sure if £135 is still a good price... but you really like it.

Then depending on your judgement of the seller make an offer of around the £100 mark and see what he says.

Then depending on the situation, ignor him untill at least Sunday evening then come back with a counter....

Also just a thought, but isn't this set up of TIG + lugs the most sensible in terms of ease of building?

I'd have thought it's much easier to use lugs for the seattube and BB sections, becasue you then don't need to faff about with the seatbolt/stays etc...

...it does look unusual tho, almost as tho a builder's used their various left over parts.

I'd get it just for the novelty.

I'd get it if I were you. As a favour I'd be prepared to take it off your hands for 120.

at least

well then I guess I just buy it and throw it in here if I hate it ;)

I have some thing similar that I have been trying to find the brand of. A sticker says 531 butit has been resprayed. The seat post is 27.0 I think, a 27.2 won't go.

The nearest I have is a concorde. I have seen the same lugs used on a number of Italian bikes and a couple of raleighs.

The seat post clamp is really neat, the left hand side is threaded, a 6mm bolt with a small diameter is out of sight.

more pics if you want.