Help! Removing cog + lockring from unbuilt hub

well, that's it...I sent my wheel to be rebuilt with new spokes and now I got a call from the guy there telling me he forgot to remove the lockring and cog before he cut the old spokes...which means that now, he can't remove the lockring cause he obviously has nothing to use as leverage...shit.

I told him to stop trying to remove it so I could ask the elders how to proceed.

its a miche low flange with a 14t cog..I'm guessing thats why he was able to remove the old spokes

help?

I've been able to resolve this by lacing just 8 spokes to a rim.

More might be better since you can't lace on the drive side because of the small flange.

Is it double sided? You can remove a tightly-screwed cog by putting one on the other side, and using two chainwhips to loosen each cog against the other. You loosen the tight one, which of course tightens the other on, but you then use less force hopefully to loosen thhe second cog against the first, and then again til they both get loose enough til you can just hold the hub with your hand, and turn one with the chainwhip. I did it a while ago with a very well tightened cog on a phil that I, really stupidly, had already unlaced.

Go the same problem at the moment too. I stupidly delaced my wheel without taking the cog and ring off first :-(
One side of the hub is spokeless, the other side(cog side) still has the spokes in as I can't get them out from behind the cog.
I'll need the hub for my new build

Go the same problem at the moment too. I stupidly delaced my wheel without taking the cog and ring off first :-(
One side of the hub is spokeless, the other side(cog side) still has the spokes in as I can't get them out from behind the cog.
I'll need the hub for my new build

you are ok then, just realace the wheel and remove the cog.

The remaining spokes are bent to fuck... :-)

I've been able to resolve this by lacing just 8 spokes to a rim.

More might be better since you can't lace on the drive side because of the small flange.

it's singlesided so this might be the answer! how do I lace 8spokes? 4 on each side?

I also had the idea (which I cant test now cause Im at work) to use a chainwhip to hold the cog and remove the lockring, then carefully vicing the hub and, with a rubber mallet, hitting the cog to loosen it..might work, right? sounds ok in my head...ahaha

shit.

That will work to remove the lock ring but don't vice the hub, you may twist it.

^what if I vice both flanges? they're the small ones so I dont think they'll break..

Get an old thick leather belt and buckle it around the hub. Then chainwhip the cog and hold the loose end of the belt as tight as you can in the other hand. Worth a try at least.

If you happen to know a friendly mechanic, he might have an oil filter strap that you could borrow. Won't damage the hub in any way and will definitely be strong enough to remove it.

Cool idea^.

I reckon a vice (with wooden blocks) on both flanges could work.

i did that once but didnot lace enough spokes, 1 spoke went through the rim and the whole rim buckled, so ;ace up enough spokes :)

^what if I vice both flanges? they're the small ones so I dont think they'll break..

If you can get both flanges clamped that could be ok. Use ether some wood blocks as Skully says on vice jaws to protects the hub flanges or some lead flashing

I remember timing myself the last time this needed to be done.

Installed 8 spokes, removed lockring and cog.

5 minutes.

The other options sound like they may take longer and require different tools.

DONE! I should've taken pics to illustrate the process.. it included:

vice on both flanges and lockring tool = broken edges on crappy miche lockring;
vice on cog teeth (not touching flanges) with lockring tool = nothing + cursing;
vice on cog teeth with hammer and chisel = sucess!

I do need a new lockring but no damage at all to neither hub or threads! it took a good half an hour and a lot of cursing...that'll teach me.

thanks for your help!

EDIT: btw, is there a miche-compatible lockring that I should know about? apart from miche ones obviously..

Phil W and... Campag I believe.

^how about one that's not worth more than the hub? ahaha

...now I got a call from the guy there telling me he forgot to remove the lockring and cog before he cut the old spokes...

Please don't forget to hammer his head... wtf!!???

ahahah I might! he's not going to charge me for the wheel build though..

i had the same problem on a Royce hub ages ago.

What i did was put 3 old spokes on the lockring side using nose pliers to bend and pull them through.
The process will damage the spokes.
Clamp the spokes in a vice with the flange resting on a piece of hardwood or anything that will take the force and not mark the flange and in itself not split or break. Pine wood is too soft and useless for this job. I already tried.
remove the lockring and turn the hub the other way to remove the cog.

And it's done!

just read you've done it, gosh, give a dog a bone why don't ya :P