Kona Sutra vs Marin Toscana vs ?

Looking to maybe invest in some gears for touring/mileage, been looking at bikes at around the £1000 rrp range. Obviously something suitable for touring isn't going to be an absolute speed machine but then again i'm only going to be touring on road so i'm not fussed about something that's suitable for riding on paths.

Looking at the Kona Sutra and the Marin Toscana and was wondering if anyone had experience of either or any other suggestions.

cheers.

Do you welcome other option?

Do you welcome other option?

for sure.

From the top of my head, the Surly long haul trucker fit right in your budget.

kona sutras are not really worth the money unless you really don't want to put a bike together yourself. the racks are awful [at least it comes with a front and rear though] and it's heavy. that probably means its pretty strong though. maybe a dawes gallaxy, although it's a bit pricey.

whats the consensus on rim vs disc brakes for touring?

the long haul trucker is a good bike frame, it even has braze ons for keeping spare spokes a nice little detail. i think the frame can be bought for 3-400 quid.

it's generally advised to get components that can be easily replaced and repaired wherever in the world you are going to be. i dont like cheap mechanical disc brakes wherever i am though.

and you have Brixton Cycles too, they can help a lots with sorting out your need.

Give SJS a call.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/THORN-AUDAX-MK3-TOURING-ROAD-BIKE-CYCLE-BICYCLE-21982_W0QQitemZ350303885368QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Bikes_GL?hash=item518fbd1838

Give SJS a call.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/THORN-AUDAX-MK3-TOURING-ROAD-BIKE-CYCLE-BICYCLE-21982_W0QQitemZ350303885368QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Bikes_GL?hash=item518fbd1838
^^Nice
Not much tyre clearance, but if you're only really riding roads, this looks spot-on (IMHO).

I've been lusting after a Soma Saga frameset to build up for some time.
Sounds like the Thorn is more in line with what you're after though.

kama sutra is better than mahabarata imo,
whilst the legends are quite engrossing, the k.s has complete system of ethics and preparation for the potential rider, before exploring the options of positions, fitting etc.

^^ Filth.

I'm also after something geared which can be used for light touring (2 small rear panniers, saddle/ bar bag). The Salsa Casseroll triple is my perfect bike but no one has a 2009 model in my size and I really don't think it's worth £1500 for the '10. Any ideas for a similarly-spec'd bike (105 double or triple, ideally steel but open-minded, room for full guards, rack eyes, but not a full-on tourer)? Can spend around a grand also.

The OTP touring frame from Bob Jackson is only £399. You could put something really nice together for under £1k I reckon.

I'm also after something geared which can be used for light touring (2 small rear panniers, saddle/ bar bag). The Salsa Casseroll triple is my perfect bike but no one has a 2009 model in my size and I really don't think it's worth £1500 for the '10. Any ideas for a similarly-spec'd bike (105 double or triple, ideally steel but open-minded, room for full guards, rack eyes, but not a full-on tourer)? Can spend around a grand also.

The Thorn MK3 (Audax/Fast tourer) comes in a SJSC special spec for £1299.
You can tweek the spec for little extra cost, but as standard it comes with a 26/36/48 chainset and a 11-32 cassette. I have this set-up on the utility bike, and really like the range of gears. You can also go STI or separate bar end shifters if you want. (I'm a big fan of bar-end shifters on such a bike myself).
http://www.sjscycles.com/thornpdf/Thorn_Audax_Mk3_lowres.pdf

The OTP touring frame from Bob Jackson is only £399. You could put something really nice together for under £1k I reckon.

I have thought about putting something together myself but I would rather get something off the peg. And there's a fairly long wait for even OTP Jackson frames...

I've seen last year's Kona Jake the Snake for a good price so I'm going to try one out. Anything else like that I should be looking at?

I have thought about putting something together myself but I would rather get something off the peg. And there's a fairly long wait for even OTP Jackson frames..?
.
TBH as tourers have lots of bits and dodas, OTP can save a lot of money. People like Thorn/SJS still let you tweek things to your needs though.

I've seen last year's Kona Jake the Snake for a good price so I'm going to try one out. Anything else like that I should be looking at?

Well thats a CycloX bike, and doesnt even have mudguard eyelets. My Utility bike is based around a CycloX frame, which has slightly faster/stiffer handling than a typical tourer/audax. Its a decent load carrrier, but I would'nt want to do uber miles on it. I have done 100km, while carrying 8 bed legs and a big bag of metal fittings, which was OK. But far from ideal. (based on this frame)
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Graham-Weigh-56cm-Cyclocross-Frame-Matt-Black_W0QQitemZ260545293987QQcmdZViewItemQQimsxq20100130?IMSfp=TL100130136001r5435

The Soma double cross is a frameset that claims to cope with some light touring.
http://somafab.com/doublecross_one.html

the Surly cross check is pretty similar.
http://www.surlybikes.com/bikes/cross_check_complete/

CycloX bikes dont have the chainstay length to move the rear pannier away from your feet though (doable though). The quicker handling and shorter chainstays can make loaded climbing a bit of a PITA.

Well thats a CycloX bike, and doesnt even have mudguard eyelets.

Not so. It has eyes for guards and rear rack. The main use is a fast but hardy commuter, with the ability to light tour; I think I've found my bike. Typically, though, I can't find my size (52 - 54 effective tt) in 2009 colours, which I *much *prefer to the 2010 model... Balls.

I got a long haul trucker for £195 of the US ebay about a month ago. Its a beaut. My dad has given me a budget of £1000 for components.

hobo, nice one, that's a good deal. i was helping a mate put together a touring bike and he decided against the lht based on the 26" wheels on the 54cm, it's only 700c on the 56cm+. my friend got a dawes gallaxy frame set which he's pretty happy with.

there are quite a few options for off the peg audax/touring bikes. that thorn is a really nice bike but the wheel set is not really up to touring, the spoke count is too low and it has caliper brakes which wont provide enough stopping power on a loaded touring bike. this is often the case with audax bikes great light tourers but not really up to trekking. two different bikes really.

if your not in any rush you can easily build a classy touring bike for way less than £1000. second hand touring frames frequently come up on ebay for great prices and they have usually only had one careful owner. the frame should ideally be steel, have braze-ons for front and rear racks, cantilever brakes, and a long chainstay. or as someone says up there, the bob jackson off the peg is not a bad price at £399.

off the peg tourers tend to be slightly overpriced and under specced, you are better off putting something together yourself. if you want a cheap bike to tour for a couple of summers or something consider a hybrid like a trek fx, they cost about £300-400 and have braze ons for front and rear racks long wheelbase etc. definitely not a bike you will love and cherish but if you aren't fussy [snobby] then they are a pretty good option in that category.

i have suggested this bike on another thread and i think its the best value off the peg audax, not at all classy though and its an aluminium frame, the ridgeback horizon...

http://www.ukbikesdepot.com/products.php?plid=m18b0s163p2328

pretty good for a light tourer commuter though.

Not so. It has eyes for guards and rear rack. The main use is a fast but hardy commuter, with the ability to light tour; I think I've found my bike. Typically, though, I can't find my size (52 - 54 effective tt) in 2009 colours, which I *much *prefer to the 2010 model... Balls.

So it does, my bad. That puts in the same sort of category as the double cross or the crosscheck I suppose.

Like I said the geometry wont be suited to heavy load carrying. But you cant beat a CycloX bike for versatility.

Personnally I'd go for the Crosscheck for the horizontal drop-outs. Because I'd like my next utility bike to have an 8 speed Alfine hub, and I love the quality of Surly framesets.

Have you considered the Kaffenback? Should come in around a a grand with a Ultegra/105 mix.
http://www.planet-x-warehouse.co.uk/acatalog/Kaffenback_and_Uncle_John_Drop_Bar_Builds.html

hobo, nice one, that's a good deal. i was helping a mate put together a touring bike and he decided against the lht based on the 26" wheels on the 54cm, it's only 700c on the 56cm+. my friend got a dawes gallaxy frame set which he's pretty happy with.
Like the Soma Saga then. TBH the 26" wheels are part of the attraction for me. I figured they'd be stronger for a given weight.

there are quite a few options for off the peg audax/touring bikes. that thorn is a really nice bike but the wheel set is not really up to touring, the spoke count is too low and it has caliper brakes which wont provide enough stopping power on a loaded touring bike. this is often the case with audax bikes great light tourers but not really up to trekking. two different bikes really.
Agree totally. But a nice fast(ish) bike if you dont expect to carry too much.

if your not in any rush you can easily build a classy touring bike for way less than £1000. second hand touring frames frequently come up on ebay for great prices and they have usually only had one careful owner. the frame should ideally be steel, have braze-ons for front and rear racks, cantilever brakes, and a long chainstay. or as someone says up there, the bob jackson off the peg is not a bad price at £399.
The size range offered is good on the BJ. I can confirm that heavy load carrying, on a bike with short chainstays, is less than ideal.

Like the Soma Saga then. TBH the 26" wheels are part of the attraction for me. I figured they'd be stronger for a given weight.

they are also supposed to help with stability giving the bike a lower centre of gravity. also if you head to certain places touring 26inch tires are going to be the easiest to find.

i opt for 700c its what i'm used to and they roll better on roads which is where i ride most.

i'd not checked out the soma saga, it does look like a well designed touring frame.

i think the specialized tricross has braze ons for rack and mudguards too. the 2009 was lighter and better than the kona jake. but cyclocross bikes are very versatile.

http://www.evanscycles.com/products/specialized/tricross-2010-cyclo-cross-bike-ec020084

they are also supposed to help with stability giving the bike a lower centre of gravity. also if you head to certain places touring 26inch tires are going to be the easiest to find.
i opt for 700c its what i'm used to and they roll better on roads which is where i ride most.
i'd not checked out the soma saga, it does look like a well designed touring frame.

I'm a short arse so 26" wheels would sit me over the bike better. Also I'd probably go for large(ish) tryes for trails and rough roads.

Another CycloX/Commuter/light-tourer/winter bike option could be the On One - Il Pompino. Built up with an Alfine hub for example. (I'm getting very bored of digging winter road paste out of my rear mech.)