Wheel rebuilding. Is it ok to reuse spokes?

I'm planning to rebuild a rear wheel next week using the old hub, spokes and nipples with new rim. The new rim is another of the same, I'm switching like-for-like.

Is it ok to use spokes that have already been used the a build? Will They hold tension a second time? Is it worth a try?

The wheel is quite highly tensioned and uses DT Swiss DB spokes with brass nips.

this is fine.

BUT you might want to get new nipples..depends how old the wheel is and what state they come out in. sometimes, being brass, they can get a bit mashed.

Yes it'll be fine, i've done it several times, no problems with it.

Oh, and UTFS ;)

...you might want to get new nipples...

Yep, my Park Tools nipple key was pretty brutal on them 1st time. Thanks.

Yes it'll be fine, i've done it several times, no problems with it.

Oh, and UTFS ;)

ta.

I did UTFS I'll have you know... how dare you!.. but there are some monster threads about wheel building, but not much on re-building (that's a red rag to a bull innit).

:P

Ahem =P

http://www.londonfgss.com/thread33523.html

Your right, good thread too. Thanks.

Been trying to work out which set of light weight wheels to get for an aggressive commuter mtb and its 110kg rider!
Its my weight which is the issue, so do not trust any 24 spoke front wheels, but still want a light weight pair.
I have found a set of wheels, with Sapim CX-Ray spokes and ZTR Crest rims, weighing in at 1520g claimed, that have 32 spoke pattern, and is still within my price range!
Only fly in the ointment is the reports I've found on the rear hub - Superstar Trizoid XC.
So, when/if this hub does die, can I re-use the Sapim CX-Ray spokes to rebuild with a Hope Pro 2 Evo which has the same 58mm PCD?

Or should I just go for the Hope Hoops Pro 2 Evo Straight Pull with ZTR Crest rims that I can get for same sorta price, weighing in at 1603g?

Yes the Hope straight pull hubs are gonna build to a stiff wheel, but so are the Sapim CX-Ray spokes on the other set!
Both use same rim, both would seem to have roughly equal stiffness, the Superstars are lighter while the Hopes are more durable hubs, so I figure that when the Superstar dies, replace with a Hope hub and keep spokes and rim.

Can you? Yes.

Should you? No.

Have I? Of course.

It's a pain in the fecking arse to do, it's not like you'll put the spokes back in anything like the same order so they'll all be bent and kinked in the wrong places and stretched out by different amounts.

Doing it yourself is one thing, getting a wheelbuilder to do it for you will probably either be very difficult or expensive.

Pro 2 Evo has different PCDs: left 56, right 54. You also have to consider the distance of the flanges from the centre of the hub: Hope - (l) 31.5, (r) 20.5; Superstar - (l) 34, (r) 23. No idea if you can reuse the spokes, but it's easy enough to put those numbers into DT Swiss' spoke calculator and see for yourself. Reuse the spokes if the differences are under 2mm.

That said, go for the Hope - seriously you are obsessing over a 83g difference. You are deluding yourself if you think 83g is gonna make any difference at all when you + clothing + bag + bike is gonna be 125kg, at best. 83g is 0.0664 percent of 125kg. Not 6.6 percent, not 0.66 percent, no, it's 0.0664 percent. Under seven-hundredth of a percent. Your hairdo of the day is going to affect your performance more, probably. Buy the Hope and be done with it.

Your words of experience make a lot of sense mechanical_vandal!

But would doing so weaken the spokes significantly?

I could unlace the wheel and re-lace in the same pattern, spoke by spoke, then get LBS to tighten properly.

Unfortunately I do not have the experience to do it myself.

Shanghaied - I had thought about that, but everyone keeps harping on about weight on the outside of wheel affecting acceleration, blar, blar, blar...

I am building this bike as I want something thats gonna be bloody quick off the lights, so I don't spend half my time getting upto speed.

But, as you say, it is only 83g, and I have the peace of mind knowing its Hope.
I just always obsess!
Wanna be sure I get the best I can for what I use it for.
Just wish I wasn't such a lard arse really as all the nice light weights are for XC whippets weighing half what I do. :P

Thanks for info on PCDs, will check further.

Indeed you are right Shanghaied, I was looking at PCD for the singlespeed/trials Pro 2 Evo.

Screw it, going for the Hopes.

Yeah I'd say the second building of a set of spokes would probably be weaker or at least more likely to go out of true and not as easy to true up again. Dunno if you'd really see more spoke breakages than if you had used the same spokes in one wheel for the same length of time.

I'll leave it to a more scientifically experienced forumenger to offer wisdom on what exactly detenisoning/delacing and relacing/retensioning will do to the spoke on a molecular level but I would have thought that a big change in the stress on the spoke - ie from completely detensioning and then retensioning - would be more detrimental than sitting under constant tension.

Re the 83g extra weight, if it's on the hub then really, really don't worry about it. The further from the centre of the wheel the weight is the more effect it has on the effort required to accelerate the wheel so adding weight as centrally as the hub will make no difference at all. Tyre and tube choice is what you should be worrying about.

As far as acceleration goes, the parts that are actually going to be on the outside of the wheels and which are going to affect acceleration the most- the rims and the tyres, are going to be the same, whichever hub you pick.

So is it fair to say, when I need to replace the worn Open Pro rim on my front wheel - I need to budget for new spokes as well as a new rim?

The Hope and Superstar hubs are roughly the same weight.
The weight loss was on the spokes, which is why I was asking.
Sapim CX-Ray spokes are lighter, stiffer and bladed, so more aerodynamic, although I doubt that'll matter too much!
But, it would affect acceleration, and ease of maintaining speed, although to what extent, I don't know.

The Hope and Superstar hubs are roughly the same weight.
The weight loss was on the spokes, which is why I was asking.
Sapim CX-Ray spokes are lighter, stiffer and bladed, so more aerodynamic, although I doubt that'll matter too much!
But, it would affect acceleration, and ease of maintaining speed, although to what extent, I don't know.

The Hope and Superstar hubs are roughly the same weight.
The weight loss was on the spokes, which is why I was asking.
Sapim CX-Ray spokes are lighter, stiffer and bladed, so more aerodynamic, although I doubt that'll matter too much!
But, it would affect acceleration, and ease of maintaining speed, although to what extent, I don't know.

fuck you computer!!!!!

Grrrr.

Ahem... Sorry for that outburst, normal service will now resume!

So is it fair to say, when I need to replace the worn Open Pro rim on my front wheel - I need to budget for new spokes as well as a new rim?

By looks of what the other, more experienced members are saying, it looks like replacing spokes is best idea.

So is it fair to say, when I need to replace the worn Open Pro rim on my front wheel - I need to budget for new spokes as well as a new rim?

Given that you'll be replacing the rim because it's worn out then I'd recommend replacing the spokes too.

The Hope and Superstar hubs are roughly the same weight.
The weight loss was on the spokes, which is why I was asking.
Sapim CX-Ray spokes are lighter, stiffer and bladed, so more aerodynamic, although I doubt that'll matter too much!
But, it would affect acceleration, and ease of maintaining speed, although to what extent, I don't know.

Heavier rim tyre and spoke would actually give you more momentum so speed maintenance would be easier (think flywheel) but that is also why it is harder to accelerate the wheel up to speed in the first place.

What I want to know is where do all the bits of unused brake cable, old spokes, old cassttes etc go? Are people recycling them? How do we recycle worn parts properly?

I use a long bit of cable snipped off when replacing for a front brake as a squirrel proof bird-feed hanger - they can climb down it ... csb etc ...

There was a girl that worked in the shop where I work that was taking metal parts to a scrappy and getting good money for them which I thought was pretty smart. She doesn't work there anymore and I'm only in once every so often so the stuff just goes in the bin now which is pretty shit.

More direct recycling like you suggest Skully is a good idea.