New poster looking for help

Hi there, I'm looking to build myself a budget SS. I've been a MTB'er all my life but don't know much about road bikes, their standard sizes etc.

I'm selling my MTBs and moving across the world so want something more suitable for the road riding I'll be doing over there.

I want to build a cheap, rigid SS. Front disc brake and nothing at the rear.

What kind of size frame should I be looking for? I'm 5' 7" and ride MTBs around 16".

Where's a good place to look for a suitable steel frame? The condition of the paint doesn't matter as an Uncle can powder coat for me.

If the frame was originally designed for curved forks, will I have a problem putting straight forks (with disc fittings) on it? If it will then what options?

Do road frames have different sized BB shells to MTBs? If so, what size do I need.

I want this bike to look beautiful. Minimal and clean but on the cheap.

Any advice or pointers as to where to find cheap but good looking components? I know I'm being a bike tart but if I can't afford bling then I can at least get a looker!

Thanks in advance,

Mike

Hi mcph,

Welcome over here.
Check out the ebay finds thread (& classifieds in general) for frames & bits. There are various folk who sell alot (Roberto / Jos - so search for them for details).

I'm no expert, but as with MTB's, type of frame / geometry / sizing etc depends on what you want to use it for. Track, commuting, all-round hack...

SS & front brake only is not a good mix (see thread in Bike & bits) (though some beg to differ) - so go fixed or keep to 2 brakes to start with. Esp if you need the stopping power of discs, you'll need both brakes.

I'm sure others will offer more help!

Hi Villa.

I'm moving to the Philipines but just can't stand to be bikeless. The riding will be on road, pretty flat, lots of traffic and not always great surfaces. A general 'hack' bike, I guess.

I want one of those beautiful, minimal 'courier' type bikes, beautiful but on the cheap.

I'm only 9.5 stone and don't 'need' the power of discs. The idea of fixed scares the shit out of me so maybe I'll look at getting rear mounts brazed on.

I'll check out those places. Cheers

I meant rear disc mounts brazed on...

look, disc hubs won't fit proper road bikes. very much doubt the clearance will be there in the chainstays.

maybe if the roads a bit rough, build up a rigid mtb ss ?

i would forget about trying to bring your mtb based preconceptions about what works and applying them to road bikes, i wouldn't bother with a disk brake as the large tyre required to make the disk brake workable (you will lock them too easily and lack modulation) negates the advantages of less rolling resistance and lower rotating weight. a decent road brake will throw you over the bars if needed.

I reckon something like this would be ideal:

wind up.

TBH (not having been to the Philippines) I would imagine something like a roadrat or pompino would be more bullet-proof - and allow for comfier, bigger tyres etc.

Or wait & see what the conditions are like out there first (though didn't you go out @ Xmas?) & what you'll be needing it for...maybe a mtb will still be useful?

(sorry - I know it is shit to answer that you don't want what you were asking about!)

inbred or cotic soul

I've got an Inbred at the moment. It's a 14" and a couple of inches too small to be an effective 'road' bike. I'd like 700cc wheels too but running large vol road tires.

I was over there at Christmas. TBH, a Road-rat with a light build would be perfect... expensive though. and that's why a 'retro' resprayed frame appeals.

I've just been online creating a list of components for a build and quickly realised the problems with brakes / hubs and it also meant more expensive carbon rigid forks for disc mounts. I hate the idea of being under-braked (hence a HOPE M4s & 205mm floating rotors on my xc bike).

Any suggestions for 1" - 26mm clamp stems and 1" steerer forks.
Which powerful road brakes? What about Dura Ace 7700 for £40? Can you use road canti brakes with mtb type brake levers? If so which levers? I want to use flat bars.

For the wheelset I was going to have Ultegra hubs, Mavic Open Sport rims and use a SS kit (spacers for 9 speed to 1 speed and a tensioner that bolts into the hanger). Is that the best way and a resonable wheelset for about £90 + £20 for SS kit?

Are road BBs the same as MTB BBs? If not, where's a good place for a cheap SS chainset and BB? Pref silver.

Thanks for the replies so far.

shimano do a flat bar lever for road brakes dunno the name/number though.

I've got an Inbred at the moment. It's a 14" and a couple of inches too small to be an effective 'road' bike. I'd like 700cc wheels too but running large vol road tires.

I was over there at Christmas. TBH, a Road-rat with a light build would be perfect... expensive though. and that's why a 'retro' resprayed frame appeals.

I've just been online creating a list of components for a build and quickly realised the problems with brakes / hubs and it also meant more expensive carbon rigid forks for disc mounts. I hate the idea of being under-braked (hence a HOPE M4s & 205mm floating rotors on my xc bike).

Any suggestions for 1" - 26mm clamp stems and 1" steerer forks.
Which powerful road brakes? What about Dura Ace 7700 for £40? Can you use road canti brakes with mtb type brake levers? If so which levers? I want to use flat bars.

For the wheelset I was going to have Ultegra hubs, Mavic Open Sport rims and use a SS kit (spacers for 9 speed to 1 speed and a tensioner that bolts into the hanger). Is that the best way and a resonable wheelset for about £90 + £20 for SS kit?

Are road BBs the same as MTB BBs? If not, where's a good place for a cheap SS chainset and BB? Pref silver.

Thanks for the replies so far.

I don't know much about MTB's but I would assume that the BB's are made for triple chainsets, and therefore wider, probably 113mm as opposed 108mm. Others more knowledgeable will advise, but in road terms you need to decide if you want a single, double or triple. Also different threads, English or Italian.
With regard to purchase, I use:
http://www.parker-international.co.uk/
http://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/

shimano do a flat bar lever for road brakes dunno the name/number though.

Shimano Tiagra R550 - £20

on one inbred 29er 700c wheels front and back discs

you'll need a bomb proof bike in phil. sturdy frame and forgiving wheelset. whichever city you end up in, rest assured, the road surface is shite. you're right a high vol (eg 28c) tyreset would be perfect. MA3k's surly steamroller runs on 28c's. if you get a low enough gearing that you could control, a rear break wouldnt be necessary. besides, traffic there is fckd...i doubt you'll be able to go any faster then 20kph.

could be fun to ride fixed there, but novelty would fade out in a day...way too much trouble. besides air quality there is the worst ive experienced

I've just been online creating a list of components for a build and quickly realised the problems with brakes / hubs and it also meant more expensive carbon rigid forks for disc mounts. I hate the idea of being under-braked (hence a HOPE M4s & 205mm floating rotors on my xc bike).

A road brake can lock your front wheel up without problem (and throw you into the road) - anything beyond this is pointless, you are just adding weight, cost and losing modulation.

Which powerful road brakes? What about Dura Ace 7700 for £40?

Dura Ace 7700 are very good for £40.

Can you use road canti brakes with mtb type brake levers? If so which levers? I want to use flat bars.

No, MTB levers and road levers have a different pull ratio (I forget which is which - but they are different by a factor of x2).

But lots of other types of lever will work fine:

For the wheelset I was going to have Ultegra hubs, Mavic Open Sport rims and use a SS kit (spacers for 9 speed to 1 speed and a tensioner that bolts into the hanger). Is that the best way and a resonable wheelset for about £90 + £20 for SS kit?

You are essentially buying a rearhub with a freehub body and then spending money to convert it to something else - and then spending more money to remedy an inherent problem in your wheel choice - no way to tension the chain.

I am not sure whether your frame has horizontal drop outs ?

If it has, simply get a rear hub that takes a screw on freewheel.

If it has not you could still get a rear hub that takes a screw on freewheel and run a chain tensioner like you planned to do with the 9 speed hub.

Or you can get a rear hub (that excepts a screw on freewheel) from White Industries that can tension the chain for you so no need for a tensioner even with non-horizontal drop outs.

Are road BBs the same as MTB BBs?

Road and MTB BB shells are the same, you can screw a MTB BB into a road frame and visa versa - although MTB shells tend to be 73mm and road tend to be 68mm.

Here is a list of drive chain set ups that work (by 'work' I mean they give you a straight chainline - so you chain doesn't jump off when you bounce around).

Crankset + BB + rear hub + cog = members name

Sugino 75 + Phil Wood + Phil Wood + Phil Wood = Cornelius Blackfoot
Sugino 75 + campag centaur 111mm + goldtec + eai = dogsballs
Sugino 75 + Miche + Formula = kowalski
Sugino 75 + Miche+ Phil Wood = adoubletap
Sugino 75 + Hatta R9400 + ShimanoHB7600 + EAI superstar cog = Tynan
Sugino 75 + Sugino 75 + Phil Wood + EAI = mr_tom
Sugino 75 + Dura Ace + Condor Goldtec + Condor CNC = Mouse
Sugino 75 + Campag Centaur 111mm + Goldtec + EAI= 31t®um
Sugino 75 + Hatta R9400 + ShimanoHB7600 + Dura-ace= Build
Sugino 75 + Phil (110.5) + Phil + EAI Superstar = Object
Sugino 75 + Miche + Phil Wood + Phil Wood = d.mac ( if it ever comes back from Condor....)

miche+miche+miche+andel+miche=fixedfreak (max)
miche + campag record 111m + goldtec + EAI = MrSmith
Miche Primato Pista + Shimano UN54/110 + Formula + Dura Ace = CHUG_IT
Miche (Condor-branded) + Miche 107mm (cups adjusted 2mm towards drivechain) + Goldtec + EAI 1/8" = eeehhhh (46mm chainline)

Sugino Messenger + Phil wood (103 jis) + phil wood + phil wood= chris crash
Sugino RD + Sugino + ambrosio + miche = asm } both are pretty much spot on
Sugino RD + UN53/107 + Condor Goldtec + EAI= hamster
Sugino RD+Sugino/103+Sys-X+Dura Ace= MA3K

Stronglight+UN53/107+Sys-X+Formula= MA3K
Stronglight + Shimano UN73 110mm + SystemEx + EAI -2mm = mr_tom
Stronglight + Stronglight + SystemEx + Tranzmission = BringMeMyFix
Stronglight + UN72 113mm + Miche + EAI = Richard Cheese (all 3/32 - chainline is not spot on, but the set-up is silent)
Stronglight + Shitmano UN26 110MM + Goldtec + EAI = RPM (3/32 spot on and silent)

Campagnolo Veloce Triple + Campag Veloce + Goldtec + Tranzmission = BringMeMyFix
Campagnolo Pista + Campag Athena + Phils (Hub and cog) = Jonny
Campagnolo Pista + Campag Pista + Campag Pista = Platini
Campagnolo Record + campag record + royce + eai = briankwan
Campagnolo Pista + Campagnolo Pista + Dura Ace + Dura Ace = Skully (can't be straight, I never get anything right)
Campagnolo Pista + Campag + ambrosia + Phil Wood = Sano
Campagnolo + Campag Centaur 111mm + Suzue Promax SB + EAI superstar = oddsock
Campagnolo Pista + Specialities TA + Phil Wood + Phil Wood = VelocityBoy
Campagnolo Pista + Campag Record 111mm (80's) + Phil + Phil = tristoo

Dura-Ace + Sugino 75 + Dura-Ace (7600) + Dura-Ace = hassanr
Dura-Ace + Shimano UN72 (unknown length) + Surly + EAI Superstar = Object
Dura Ace+UN53/107+Dura Ace+Dura Ace= MA3K
Dura-Ace+ UN54/107+ Suzue Promax SB+ Surly= Eyebrows

DOTEK cheapy + Campag Mirage + Formula + Dura-Ace = fc9k
DOTEK cheapy + shimano BBUN26x113mm +OnOne small flange double fixed hub + Miche1/8sprocket = xroads

TA + TA(314) + Campag + Miche = Fruitbat
Truvativ + (??) stock bianchi pista + phil wood + EAI = asm }
Middleburn RS1+ Shimano XT 68 113+ White Bros Eno + Surly/ Miche= tommid
White Industries + Shimano 110mm + Phils + White Industries = big daddy wayne
Paul + Campag Centaur 111mm + paul + phil = flickwg
SR Sakae + Shimano UN54 118mm + SJS (SystemEx et al) + Andel = ChrisNW
Zeus Pista (circa 80's) + Campag Pista 109mm + Formula + Miche = tristoo

where's a good place for a cheap SS chainset and BB? Pref silver

http://www.hubjub.co.uk/sugino/sugino.htm

£49

I was over there at Christmas. TBH, a Road-rat with a light build would be perfect... expensive though. and that's why a 'retro' resprayed frame appeals.

I've got a Roadrat. I bought it last year as I was just starting to look into road bikes. It's a nice frame, but I find now I just think it looks a little weird. Get a proper road bike. I'm just going to run it into the ground then get something else.

You don't need disc brakes. I had discs brakes and it's overkill. Seriously.

There is no such thing as road cantilever brakes.

There are normal cantilever brakes (short cable pull) or linear pull cantilever brakes (v style brakes, long cable pull).

Linear pull pull more cable at less force so if you want to run normal cantis you can use any short pull lever. Some brake levers for v brakes actually have two settings to allowing the use of either short or long pull brakes. Otherwise ther are plenty of short pull flat bar levers out there.

Some brake levers for v brakes actually have two settings to allowing the use of either short or long pull brakes.

Good point, you could use the reach adjustment screw on some MTB V brake levers to tone them down a little - so you may be able to use them with a road caliper.

why don't you just take your montain bike with you, the roads in the phillipines are shit a mate of mine told me...

Gabes - the roads over there aren't too bad in the main part. I'll be living in the well-off financial district of Manila (the capital) so the roads tend to be well surfaced. A few back roads are in an awful condition but not enough to stop me wanting rigid and 700cc wheels.

Re: brake levers. I've some old XT 'V' brake levers. The ones with the three-point adjustment for cable pull. I've a feeling those might work. If not it seems there are plenty of alternatives.

Tynan - do you know where I could get those white levers? The look lurvely. Are they in production or were they a lucky find?

sounds perfect. I don't have a frame yet. All but one that I've looked at had vertical dropouts. I thought that without horizontal dropouts or an eccentric BB you needed a tensioner etc to run SS. Obviously not! "Or you can get a rear hub (that excepts a screw on freewheel) from White Industries that can tension the chain for you so no need for a tensioner even with non-horizontal drop outs." sounds perfect. I'll have a look for one. I'll have to go through that list of '"working" SS combos to find a tgood 'un i.e. cheap :-)

I think fixed is for suicidal maniacs... not me just yet. I've just taken the rear disc off my hardtail. I'm going to see what it's like for a few commutes and decide, based on that, if I can run front only brakes.

Thanks for all the posts. After these answers and a night browsing online the prospect of building my SS isn't so daunting.

Thanks again,
Mike

i'm pretty sure v brake levers won't work with calliper brakes.
you need either bmx or road levers.
also, you do need horizontal dropout to go ss without a tensioner/eccentric hub.
and a wouldn't ride with a single front disc! it locks up too hard, you'll faceplant in no time at all.

I wasn't sure about those levers Mister K. Now I know there are plenty of available levers for flat bars that won't be a problem.

I rode for a week last summer without a rear brake when I mangled a hub and the only spare wheel I had was for rim brakes. The wasn't too bad even off road no face-plants!

I *thought *I'd need a tensioner for vertical dropout single-speeding. Isn't "Or you can get a rear hub (that excepts a screw on freewheel) from White Industries that can tension the chain for you so no need for a tensioner even with non-horizontal drop outs." available then? I guess I can still get a single speed hub and tensioner but I don't need an 8/9/10 speed freewheel and then a converter to make it SS. I thought the reason for having a multi-speed hub and then using the spacers on the freewheel was to give some adjustment for a perfect chain line.

i'm pretty sure v brake levers won't work with calliper brakes

you need either bmx or road levers..

If they have the cable pull adjustment they will be fine. Cable pull is the issue.