For Sale: 1978 condor italia pista

I would like to sell my 1978 Condor Italia Pista Track frame in Reynolds 531 tubing. Metallic Deep candy red. (I think this was a special colour)
According to Condor this frame was the 11th Italia made in 1978 with unusual eyes (tops of seatstays) for extra rigidity:-

"I've spoken with Grant Young, my MD. I thought it might have been a Sienna because of the shape of the short top eyes, he's noted that whoever was the original purchaser they'd specified a stiffer rear section so therefore the top eyes are slightly unusual.
You also have an original track fork.

The frame would have been made at 144 Grays Inn Road workshop.

I've included the page from the 1976-78 catalogue and it will have more detail about the frame.

The frame number indicates that the bike was the (1178) 11th Italia to be built that year, 1978.

Thanks,
Claire"

The frame is is super condition for age (please see pics) with an absolutely minute mark on the top tube from the usual tap by bars but this is too small to show up when I tried to photograph it. Beautiful long lugs. Overall condition is amazing for age (with an original BCF centenary sticker) with only minor chips etc and small areas where rider's name stickers have been removed from top tube (laquer still intact)
I have not been able to find another one of these vintage Italia Pistas for sale anywhere and am only selling as I would never be able to replace this frame if damaged in a race and I cannot justify having two track bikes (just bought new Umezawa as although expensive it can easily be replaced)
The round 531 forks have (as I measured it) 25mm (1 inch) rake which makes, I believe, for a very stable ride (more trail) particularly useful on steeply banked velodromes. (contrary to some views track bikes are amongst the least twitchy of bike types)
Sizes are :- seat tube ctt approx (pretty accurate to best of my ability) 52cm top tube ctc is also 52cm (probably in inches originally)
Comes with SR (Sakae Royal) Bottom Bracket (nice and smooth), Ofmega headset (minor corrosion on outer top) and original Condor seatpost bolt which is really nice, Also included pair of original Condor bar end plugs.
This is a really beautiful and rare frame. She rides absolutely beautifully on steep indoor tracks and Herne Hill and Welwyn and I hope whoever buys it will treasure and enjoy it.
(marks on bb pic are just grease)
£525 GONE TO EBAY

donation will be made to forum on sale.

Dibs plus PM please.

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It's a nice looking frame but I don't know if you'll get £525 for a late seventies condor italia even in that nick.

nice margin on that

Thrust. I have no idea how to price it so anyone is welcome to make any genuine offers. £525 was just a place to start. Pricing is a nightmare - I would keep it if I could afford to but I can't justify more than one track bike and couldn't afford to build up two complete bikes anyway.
There are some items on this forum that are very cheap (recent Moser Lopro and parts to think of one) and others that seem very expensive.

plexarice :-1, you don't know the margin till I've sold it (minus forum donation)

            2, you didn't comment on the money I lost selling to forum members           my Zullo,  SJS frame, wheels and cranks,  and Felt.
            3, I didn't buy it to sell I've used it and why should I price it in relation to cost as long as it is a fair price - I'm not offering penicillin in post-war Vienna.
             4, Honest answers now;... You buy a Cinelli Lazer for £100 how much you gonna sell it for...£110 ?   And if I bought one for £10 and offered it you for £100 you would refuse it because of my excessive margin right?

You're NOT offering penicillin in post war Vienna?! Grrrr, why not, you ...
/homersimpson

Skully - Well I suppose I could let you have a few phials - how much do you want?
Regards Harry Lime.

Stunning.

how much did you pay for it?

photo with wheels?

Pic at Herne Hill

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Lovely frame cant find one the same anywhere just been looking, Great price I think for such a rare piece of fun! I think I may have seen this at Calshot about a month ago? good luck with sale worth every cent.

Looks lovely. If it was ~£200 + postage I'd take it.

I swear this was on eBay or somewhere recently? I presume that's what others are alluding to. I actually recall it being far too expensive the first time 'round too.
Can't be worth more than £250-300, for me.

/csb

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1978-CONDOR-ITALIA-PISTA-TRACK-FRAME-VERY-RARE-/321305441512?nma=true&si=6%252FinWfma1VL3Ek5oVqy7myWvrps%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

Yeah, the blurb's been lifted from the original eBay description. It was going for £650 and has somehow found its way on here. I assume the sellers are the same person, so there's nothing suspect about any of it, I don't think.
Whether it's worth what they're asking I have no idea, but it's a lovely looking frame.

Thanks for to those of you who have made positive comments. Just to clear a few points up. I had this for sale on Ebay which is where I sell parts which I have used (I do NOT deal in bike parts or buy to sell I just can't resist buying , using , changing bits etc -you know the deal sometimes I make money often I lose a little)
I was offered £425 plus postage (I can prove this to whoever buys this frame) but I had reservations about sending to China even though the guy had a super feedback rating, from both a postal and moral standpoint. So I removed it from sale and put it on here - I am happy to accept an amount which will give me what I would have got from the Ebay sale (after donation to forum) - everyone should benefit.
As to the frame being worth only 250 to 300 - just spend a minute or two and look on this or any forum or Ebay and see what kind of track frame you can actually buy for that sort of money - occasionally a bargain - very often good but run-of-the-mill mundane or an obscure brand or somewhat damaged frame.
This IS a rare frame in exceptional , original condition for it's age and rides very nicely (including at Calshot monoglaze ! ). I've just bought a brand new NJS Umezawa to race and cannot justify hanging on to the Condor or risk damaging it - If I was not racing I would certainly be keeping the Condor and it always got a lot of attention.
I actually reckon it's worth a lot more than I'm asking (Also comes with lovely SR Royal BB) - as a friend of mine who deals in rare watches says "find another one cheaper"
Cheers Si

It is a lovely frame....and what it is worth depends on how much someone wants it....how long is a piece if string....so glws.

However the BB might be problematical.....it is 106mm and ISO.....so won't work with too many chainsets inc SR Royal and Miche.....just saying.

Thanks for your positive comments marxist_vulcan. However Bottom bracket is 109mm Sakae Royal (SR) with JIS taper compatable with any JIS crankset .Frame is for 120 rear OLD. I believe 106mm would be for 110 rear.
Cheers Si

Thanks for your positive comments marxist_vulcan. However Bottom bracket is 109mm Sakae Royal (SR) with JIS taper compatable with any JIS crankset .Frame is for 120 rear OLD. I believe 106mm would be for 110 rear.
Cheers Si

I am currently [about to sell] my 106mm BB and cranks....and the rear is 120mm and they work fine...but i take your point...and apologise for my comment as i was in error....you never said Pista...and it is a lovely colour too....so GLWS.

I have no issues with anyone making a profit or buying cheap and selling for the actual worth of an item. This probably isn't a good time of year to try to sell this frame, or any other frame. But, I think you might be asking a bit much. To illustrate; I recently bought a Mercian in similar condition and degree of collectability for half the price you're asking, complete with BB and headset. The price you are asking is 'collector only', there are many usable frames out there for much less. It is a lovely frame, but you'll either have to be patient or drop the price (the £425 you were offered was a good price), maybe re-advertise in April. Sorry to be negative, I'm trying to be realistic.

"I was offered £425 plus postage (I can prove this to whoever buys this frame) but I had reservations about sending to China even though the guy had a super feedback rating, from both a postal and moral standpoint. So I removed it from sale and put it on here - I am happy to accept an amount which will give me what I would have got from the Ebay sale (after donation to forum)"

then why advertise it on here for £100 more than you'd accept an offer for on ebay? Surely avertise it here at £425 (or even £425 minus the ebay fee)?

It is a lovely frame....and what it is worth depends on how much someone wants it....how long is a piece if string....so glws.

This basically. Lovely looking frame that you could well see advertised with someone like Hilary Stone for a similar price. If someone wants it they'll buy it. Sure there could be some price negotiation with the seller too.

Marxist_vulcan ....no worries mate.

Christails .....is how I price my frame your concern unless you want to make me an offer? If any one wants it I will take a fair offer if I want to. You see its MY frame and I can ask what I want. If I choose not to accept £425 plus postage and get pissed off with the whole Ebay thing and don't want to wait for higher offers on Ebay then I can put it on here at a negotiable price. If a buyer and I are both very happy with the price we agree then all will be well in the garden (who knows the film reference there?) and it don't need to get any more complicated than that.

hanuman....spot on I'd like to get abs min £375 plus £25 to donate to forum (after any costs) but obviously I had to start a bit higher.The Ebay auction had a long while to run and lots of watchers so better offers may well have come in esp as track season approaches
Cheers Si

A lovely frame indeed and a good bloke is Si46, GLWS

So it's £375 + £25 for forum + any costs p&p. No offers please.
Thanks Si

as a friend of mine who deals in rare watches says "find another one cheaper"

+1

This thread, and other comments I've heard about prices, always make me think: Go and buy a well made, new custom frame & fork for much less than £900. And quite right too, frame builders should earn more.

Same applies to second or third hand, if it's in great condition, ask what someone may pay.