What is the difference between different level Campag Ergo shifters?

Was wondering, what is the actual difference between say, a 9-speed Record Ergo Shifter and a 9-Speed Xenon Ergo Shifter (from different years of course)? I tried using the fucking search, but alas, nothing was found.

Surely the mechanisms are the same, as they work in the same way? Is it just that record has record written on it, and it weighs a bit less? Or does Record shift quicker, or is it built to a higher accuracy?

I'd imagine they are pretty much the same. As the technology gets older they sell it for less and maybe use alloy for parts that might have been carbon on top end components.

Well, Campag has exploded diagrams of all their shifters under Technical Documentation on their website, with specific numbers for each part so that they can be ordered as spares. Each spare part number has a two letter prefix, so it's something like SR for Super Record, RE for Record, CH for Chorus etc. What is really interesting though is that the top three or four groups are basically exactly the same until about last year, ie ALL the spare parts for Super Record, Record, and Chorus (and Athena until 2010) shifters have exactly identical part numbers, with the prefix SR, the only difference is in the brake lever itself. I don't remember the exact number but I think S Record and Athena carbon shifter only had something like 10 gram difference in weight, which is easily accounted for by the different levers.

Of course since 2011 from Athena and downwards the shifters can only shift 3 gear at a time down and 1 up, as oppose to 5 down and 3 up for Chorus and upwards, so the innards were downgraded accordingly. But the lower end stuff still share innards, as do the upper end stuff. Which makes sense really, since there's only so much you can do with the tiny nuts and bolts inside, and it makes no business sense to make 5-6 different versions of every single part. This has been the case since at least 2000, before that I don't know since I was too young and had other things on my mind.

So to answer your question, not much, especially on stuff before 2011. Mirage and Xenon had plastic levers and usually has one gear less than the more expensive stuff (ie 9sp vs. 10sp, or 10sp vs. 11sp), Veloce and Centaur had aluminium levers. And the really fancy stuff, Chorus and Record, had plastic levers again (well carbon). I'll say this though, I've found the carbon and aluminium levers to be a bit stiffer than the plastic levers.

It's worth avoiding the mirage and xenon plastic levers. The brake lever is flexy to the point of poor braking control and a few years back I snapped both of the plastic gear levers on my set. It's kind of pleasing to read that in many cases the innards are the same though!

Well, Campag has exploded diagrams of ... to be a bit stiffer than the plastic levers.

Oh shit, I missed this, thanks Shanghaied, thats really helpful. I guess theoretically you could just buy a pair of xenon levers, buy a pair of the record lever parts alone, replace them and voilà, you have record levers hahah!

It's worth avoiding the mirage and xenon plastic levers. The brake lever is flexy to the point of poor braking control and a few years back I snapped both of the plastic gear levers on my set. It's kind of pleasing to read that in many cases the innards are the same though!

Thats crazy! What happened? Was it a bloody and gory ending to your partnership with Xenon/Mirage?

Oh shit, I missed this, thanks Shanghaied, thats really helpful. I guess theoretically you could just buy a pair of xenon levers, buy a pair of the record lever parts alone, replace them and voilà, you have record levers hahah!

Well, not Xenon and not the new Athena. But yes, you could theoretically buy Athena shifters from 2010, replace the levers and get essentially the same shifter as 2010 Super Record. But practically why would you though? As I said the difference in weight is less than 10 grams.

And spare parts are EXPENSIVE. The problem is that we have been spoiled by large online retailers and their deep discounts. But most don't do spares. You have to go through your local Campag dearler, who goes through the national distributor, who will charge exactly MRRP since spares are such low volume items. In the past three years I have paid about £40 for a Shimano disc brake master cylinder cover (a tiny bit of plastic with a rubber gasket and two screws), around £50 for a Shimano hub cone and locknut, and just over £100 for a Campag alloy hub axle. In my case it was a little cheaper and a lot less hassle than for example rebuilding a wheel with new hub. I can only imagine what Campagnolo would want for Super Record levers. But why would you do that to perfectly fine shifters for the sake of 10 grams and some lettering?

No, I wasn't actually going to do it, the thought was just for my amusement ;)

Thats crazy! What happened? Was it a bloody and gory ending to your partnership with Xenon/Mirage?

Nah both times it was just a bit startling, they happened several years apart too, as I just replaced the broken right hand the first time rather than the pair. I can't remember where I was on the second occasion but the first was on a stretch of dual carraigeway at the bottom of a long decent so I was in something like 53x12 and as I started to ease off into the next uphill I tried to flick down a few gears and the leaver just pinged off. Given the traffic and the speed I didn't stop or go back. I was just stuck with no ability to change down the sprockets for the ride home. I think I managed to lock the mech off somewhere in the middle of the cassette and ride home.

Nah both times it was just a bit startling, they happened several years apart too, a... I can't remember where I was on the second occasion ...o lock the mech off somewhere in the middle of the cassette and ride home.

Must've been really bad.

£100 for an axle? You my friend were well and truly had on that one - They are only £50 RRP for the most expensive ones....

Who charged you that extortionate amount?

Well, not Xenon and not the new Athena. But yes, you could theoretically buy Athena shifters from 2010, replace the levers and get essentially the same shifter as 2010 Super Record. But practically why would you though? As I said the difference in weight is less than 10 grams.

And spare parts are EXPENSIVE. The problem is that we have been spoiled by large online retailers and their deep discounts. But most don't do spares. You have to go through your local Campag dearler, who goes through the national distributor, who will charge exactly MRRP since spares are such low volume items. In the past three years I have paid about £40 for a Shimano disc brake master cylinder cover (a tiny bit of plastic with a rubber gasket and two screws), around £50 for a Shimano hub cone and locknut, and just over £100 for a Campag alloy hub axle. In my case it was a little cheaper and a lot less hassle than for example rebuilding a wheel with new hub. I can only imagine what Campagnolo would want for Super Record levers. But why would you do that to perfectly fine shifters for the sake of 10 grams and some lettering?

I've had good deals from Sidcup Cycles for Campagnolo spares.

I know it's going back a bit but be warned that in 2001 Campag changed the amount of cable pull their ergo levers produced and the rear derailleurs gearing changed, so in effect you have 2 versions of Campag, pre 2001 (all 8 speed and early 9 speed) and post 2001 (late 9 speed and all 10 speed). Mix them up and the shifting will be all over the place.
Next question, how do you tell the difference between the 2 versions of 9 speed ? for that you need the "knowledge" !

simple.. early 9spd stuff has the same hoodie shape as the 8spd shifters, ide est, pointy top, large bulky body.

later 9spd had the same style from 2000 till 2009 perhaps?

that's all.

new:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181238058955?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1431.l2649

wheraas the old:
http://i.ebayimg.com/t/campagnolo-veloce-9-speed-ego-levers-both-left-and-right-/00/s/NDgwWDY0MA==/z/BMwAAOxyHntSWvB5/$(KGrHqNHJBkFJSd5!DKBBSWvB4wOVg~~60_12.JPG
http://i.ebayimg.com/t/campagnolo-veloce-9-speed-ego-levers-both-left-and-right-/00/s/NjQwWDQ4MA==/z/CZAAAOxy86RSWvB0/$T2eC16dHJG!FFm1BDJ)6BSWvB0JPPw~~60_12.JPG

daytona (aka centaur-athena) and veloce

if anyone has idea how to make the hoods of the second style to fit the early ones, i'd appreciate to hear it.. :)

In defence of Mirage, I've been using the 10 speed levers for 3 year now (2nd hand bike that had hardly been used) and I had read the stories about the plastic levers, but they've been great and might be the best value as they usually go for around £35 on ebay. Also the shifting is great, so i always suspected that the innards were the same. Any truth in the story that Campagnolo try out the new stuff on their lower range so it goes under the radar then introduce it on the higher spec once they've ironed out any teething issues? Again these were are the first Mirage 10 speed (2006) and have worked like a breeze. Having said that I haven't thrashed the bike, summer use only. Anyway, thumbs up for MIrage 10 speed

I know it's going back a bit but be warned that in 2001 Campag changed the amount of cable pull their ergo levers produced and the rear derailleurs gearing changed, so in effect you have 2 versions of Campag, pre 2001 (all 8 speed and early 9 speed) and post 2001 (late 9 speed and all 10 speed). Mix them up and the shifting will be all over the place.
Next question, how do you tell the difference between the 2 versions of 9 speed ? for that you need the "knowledge" !

I only know cause i was chasing a cheap rear derailleur for a bike a few weeks back.

As per brandford bikes:

Pre-2001 nine speed rear derailleurs have a "B" adjusting screw located on the derailleur hanger tab next to the frame hanger mounting bolt. The "B" adjusting screw butts against your frame's rear dropout and allows you to adjust the angle of the derailleur body. 2001 to current 9 and 10 speed rear derailleurs have the "B" adjusting screw located at the junction of the derailleur body and pulley wheel cage.

You can run the 2001-> 9s rear derailleurs with 10speed shifters tho i never did as i bought a complete bike with 10speed group as it was cheaper in the end. Go figure..