Addison Lee drivers told to defy bus lane law (and to just say SMIDSY)

Maybe number 3 should be:

3) Take primary position where possible on all roads, but especially on all bus lanes... do not allow yourself to feel forced out of the bus lane.

How about "Take primary position when appropriate"?

Otherwise I'd be concerned that we're gifting Mr Griffin with "these loony left cyclists are deliberately blocking tax paying traffic, at a time of recession, blah blah look at my tie"

But... he likes publicity stunts.

So hopefully he'll agree to the training offer and agree to publicity.

3) Take primary position in bus lanes and ride slower when Addison Lee cars are around (ensuring your safety first and foremost).

Great idea, a new reclaim the streets. (I have often thought of a "primary position day" across London as an effective campaigning action which should be less disruptive than CM and actually give people who are wary of doing this confidence and perhaps plant the idea that it actually makes them safer. This would be more noticeable than mass/flash rides which generally go unseen by most people. )

My Twitter timeline is full of cyclists vowing to boycott them. Including my manager's manager.

But would make drivers of motorised traffic hate us.

Why would making people really, really angry with all cyclists help?

How about "Take primary position when appropriate"?

Otherwise I'd be concerned that we're gifting Mr Griffin with "these loony left cyclists are deliberately blocking tax paying traffic, at a time of recession, blah blah look at my tie"

And taking primary position is not blocking traffic. It is becoming part of the moving traffic. If anything it will slow bike riders more unless we filter (to the right of the queue)

Because he will be more likely to take it up if he's not put on the spot like its a publicity stunt. He then may be more open and receptive

So there are two bits to this answer then.

1. He's more likely to take it up if the offer is in private. - I'm not sure I totally buy this, but yes, a private offer could be made first, with a public one following later. The public one would have lost a lot of it's impact by then, so I guess it might not in fact be worth doing.

2. If he goes along because he's been offered it quietly, rather than in a blaze of publicity, there's a good chance that he'll get an awful lot more out of the training, as he won't feel that he has to respond to the public offer.

Totally get that, and fair points.

Why would making people really, really angry with all cyclists help?

Drivers in London are also more used to people riding primary than anywhere else in the uk (the world?).

So deliberately riding in front of them when their is no reason will cheer them up will it?

This is a tough one. I'm against more cars in the bus lane, but not in favour of the exclusive status of black cabs. Why shouldn't minicabs be allowed in? Black cabs are not better drivers, the just have richer passengers. I've been almost hit by a black cab and convinced the passengers to get out without paying. Organising a boycott is the best call.

If Griffin wins and the usage of bus lanes extends to mini-cabs as well, then I am going to drive my car in them. What is the difference between them and me? Where does it end?

Are black cabs allowed carte blanche in bus lanes, or do they have to have a paying fare onboard?

Mr B Oddy

You rang?

So deliberately riding in front of them when their is no reason will cheer them up will it?

Depends how fast traffic is moving surely?

You rang?

Oh no, now I've got the damn Maddona song in my head again!

#Bill Oddie, Bill Oddie, put your hands all over my body...

ARGH!

But would make drivers of motorised traffic hate us.

Why would making people really, really angry with all cyclists help?

I don't know. When I'm driving I get mightily pissed off when I see minicabs skipping queues by diving into bus lanes.

If I saw an Addy Lee being held up in a bus lane by a cyclist riding by the book, I might just chortle to myself. I am petty by nature.

I'll just leave this here

I didn't actually read this first time round, assuming it'd just be the usual tossy spiel. Glad I did though... what an unbelievably ignorant tosswipe. Breathtaking.

However, and I say this extremely tentatively, he's right in suggesting that there are a lot of inexperienced or foolhardy cyclists on the road. I notice bad cyclists more than bad motorists on the whole. Furthermore, a lot of reasonable and well-meaning people (such as my dad) would agree in principle with a lot of the above.

Griffin's views are very ordinary and are held by a large part of the population--it's a cultural issue. With people like him, you need to tackle these arguments head-on. And while he's wrong about most things (he's right that lack of skill in cyclists is not a desirable thing, for instance, but I wonder if he knows about cycle training--you'd hope that that's what he refers to), he's at least open about them and, I'd guess, probably not averse to dialogue. It's funny sometimes--you can get people with very bigoted views but actually realise that you can talk to them.

Have you offered him cycle training yet, David? If he rides hire bikes (someone said that he had a hire bike key?), he'd have to jump at the chance of getting trained, if he hadn't already been.

...on the case ;)

Hang on. You called me to task when I said my biggest perception of risk came from other cyclists. This page, the Road.CC comment section and many others on this subject are full of reasoned people saying that there are a lot of poor cyclists. Not that I'm trying to derail from the ignorance of bertie big bollocks with the long tie here but again there has to be a sense of getting our own houses in order and not allowing rabble rousers to keep beating a;ll of us with the same stick repeatedly. To sum it up:

"The Addison Lee MD is attacking cyclists because we are allowed to use the bike lanes, and his cars aren't."

WAC

3) Take primary position in bus lanes and ride slower when Addison Lee cars are around (ensuring your safety first and foremost).

I wouldn't be in favour of using 'primary position' (which is anyway subject to all sorts of definitions) in this way. Positioning is about safety, I would be uneasy about it being used to make a *point about safety. * Making a vehicle wait behind you (or going slower than you would normally do in the specific situation) when it is safe for them to pass is discourteous and provocative.
Road positioning is a dynamic and often subtle thing; encouraging cyclists to take up one position at all times is the opposite of what Cycle Training is about.
Confronting and annoying individual drivers is not the way to go and will be counter productive.
One last point - in the last mayoral elections one candidate, Boris Johnson, received £25,000 from the owner of Addison Lee. If people do not want to see that candidate elected again (and he has been silent on the bus lane matter) then they should think about where they place their crosses in May.

I think we should get Saga in on this, too.

Road positioning is a dynamic and often subtle thing; encouraging cyclists to take up one position at all times is the opposite of what Cycle Training is about.

All true yet as a protest which was widely publicised it would be less annoying for drivers than waiting for 20 minutes while the critical mass goes past. There would need for a huge build up and publicity about 'middle of the lane day' . We may have enough 'critical mass' of riders especially during the commute for it to succeed. And it could only work in London at the moment

he has been silent on the bus lane matter

I have a strong suspicion that Griffin was asked to delay this until Johnson was in purdah and couldn't be called to task for not commenting on it. If I'm right, that would be further connivance. However, I may of course be completely wrong, as I have no evidence.

I have a strong suspicion that Griffin was asked to delay this until Johnson was in purdah and couldn't be called to task for not commenting on it. If I'm right, that would be further connivance. However, I may of course be completely wrong, as I have no evidence.

Johnson is concealing women from men?

All true yet as a protest which was widely publicised it would be less annoying for drivers than waiting for 20 minutes while the critical mass goes past. There would need for a huge build up and publicity about 'middle of the lane day' . We may have enough 'critical mass' of riders especially during the commute for it to succeed. And it could only work in London at the moment

I think it's a mistake to mix up good, everyday, cycling practice with protests. It's hard enough to win the argument about us having the right to take up assertive positions at the best of times; having those positions portrayed as a one-off demonstration won't help at all.
And that is leaving aside whether or not a protest would have any effect - I don't think it would. Critical Mass gets mentioned but this, and everything else that has happened in the last few years, just goes to prove again what an ineffective campaigning tool it is.

All we have to do is ride as we normally do when on the bus lane, which I always take the primary either way due to approaching motorcyclists and the fact it's generally too narrow for a taxi/bus to overtake me without going onto the other lane.

No need to ask everyone to change their behaviour, unless they tend to hug the kerbs like their live depend on it.

it would be interesting to see what would happen if most cyclists rode that way even if done for a protest. It may not be disruptive particularly, and as Ed just said may give some kerb huggers a chance to try riding further out. There such an instinct to keep left among most people who ride bikes which is borne out of the cultural dominance and deference to people who move around in cars