Old and new Campy 10 speed compatibility

Its a massive problem! look at all the fake OEM carbonfibre frames on ebay, if they start to get a reputation for being just as good as the original issue frames then why would anyone spend the extra money to buy the real one?

Slowly but surely companies like pinarello are going to lose more and more potential customers. When your potential market is already small that's seriously bad news, I can see them regretting it in the long term. That OEM bike isn't going to pay R and D costs, it isn't going to pay for the sponsorship of the big competitions or the other advertising costs.

Plus if all the stuff is made in china, well then what's to stop a chinese company setting up and taking market share?...because after all the chinese stuff will be just as good as the campag stuff because that's where they will have learnt their trade.

You are starting to see it now with chinese motorbikes, ok the first generation are rubbish but they are honda & suzuki clones...when they finally iron out the issues they are going to dominate the market, just as the japanese did back in the 60s & 70s I think the japanese are going to live to regret having sold the chinese the old machining for their engines.

Look at the chinese throughout history and you will see that things they invented like silk they kept the secret to themselves and built a big wall. That's exactly what europe and the west should be doing with its intellectual property because the chinese have zero respect for intellectual property or copyright.

Fake OEM? It can't be fake if it's OEM - THEY are making it. Just because it's the same frame Pina chooses to use doesn't make it fake. Pina made the decision to purchase an OTP Chinese made carbon frame. If that OTP Chinese frame is sold to other brands or made available that's for them to decide.

Pinarello, etc. will lose customers because they are painting something made in China and adding £2k to the price tag for their brand to be stuck on it. People will still pay for the brand name but if this is watered down due to Italian companies out-sourcing to Chinese carbon manufacturers that's the fault of the Italians not the Chinese.

Chinese setting up and taking market share where? With what? You mean selling ACTUAL Pina frames? They might get away with it in China where western companies are pretty slack at pursuing IP infringements but they'll clamp down on it quick smart if the Chinese tried to sell Pina branded frames outside their borders. China does have IP and copyright laws.

Japanese motorbike manufacturing stole their ideas from western manufacturers, really? I know bugger all about motorbike history but as far as I'm aware Honda and Kawasaki don't copy the west, they invented a better product at the expense of the failing western options - similar to their smaller, better cars taking the place of gas guzzling Aussie and US makes during the oil crisis in the 70s.

Silk as an example, really? That was 2000 years ago..
http://www.silk-road.com/artl/silkhistory.shtml

If western companies want to keep using generic frames built in China and overcharging us for their logos then it's their own fault if we decide generic is 'good enough'.