Who was at the demo today?

First ever strike for ATL.

i was supporting from the safety of my own home. i went to some of the student protests about the cuts but missed the one today, how was it? looking at some of the reports it seems the numbers were good, you should have recruited some people for critical mass tomorrow

Load of bullshit that, I was at work, teaching lessons and covering lessons for those who did take a day off school. I honestly dont think teachers should have the right to strike

Its about time you lot joined the rest of us in the real world the countrys on its arse and we all need to accepted that the good old days are over and if you want something your going to have to work harder and longer for it.

Load of bullshit that, I was at work, teaching lessons and covering lessons for those who did take a day off school. I honestly dont think teachers should have the right to strike

Not in the union?

Its about time you lot joined the rest of us in the real world the countrys on its arse and we all need to accepted that the good old days are over and if you want something your going to have to work harder and longer for it.

Just call him Dave....

The only thing wrong about yesterdays strikes was the timing. They should have done it slap bang in the middle of GCSE exam time.

Do they even do GCSE's any more?

Its about time you lot joined the rest of us in the real world the countrys on its arse and we all need to accepted that the good old days are over and if you want something your going to have to work harder and longer for it.

Daily Mail

Daily Mail

I hope you not suggesting I read the Daily mail because I dont!
Never have never will I prefer the Sun more pictures and bigger boobs =-O
My views are my own ohh please dont call me dave it will just confuse me.

Load of bullshit that, I was at work, teaching lessons and covering lessons for those who did take a day off school. I honestly dont think teachers should have the right to strike

Well then, my considered response is FUCK YOU.

^ Like x 1000000

My company made 16000 people redundant last year.

Try private sector life

My company made 16000 people redundant last year.

Try private sector life

Come work in the public sector then!

My company made 16000 people redundant last year.

Try private sector life

Who do you work for?

Firstly, far fewer private sector workers (estimates seem to vary from 15-30%) get *any pension at all. *It's hugely offensive watching relatively well-off and job-secure people protesting to keep taxpayers topping up their contributions.

Secondly, stop blaming "the bankers" for everything. It's immature and overly simplistic. Private debt, China/India et al's competetiveness and the resulting impact on employment and inflation, our demographic crisis and numerous other factors mean everyone is having to tighten their belts. Would you prefer your kids to pay for your pensions?

Thirdly, if what you want is higher pay, argue for that, not pensions as some sort of vague compensation.

Fourthly, if you want public support, don't strike while negotiations are still on-going. You just lost the moral highground.

Firstly, far fewer private sector workers (estimates seem to vary from 15-30%) get *any pension at all. *It's hugely offensive watching relatively well-off and job-secure people protesting to keep taxpayers topping up their contributions.

Dan the sole point of private sector jobs is to make shareholders richer. Providing pensions doesn't make money so they don't do it. If you want a public sector style pension, work in the public sector, for the people rather than the MAN!

Secondly, stop blaming "the bankers" for everything. It's immature and overly simplistic. Private debt, China/India et al's competetiveness and the resulting impact on employment and inflation, our demographic crisis and numerous other factors mean everyone is having to tighten their belts. Would you prefer your kids to pay for your pensions?

Blaming the bankers for everything is overly simplistic. But suggesting that public sector workers need to shut up, 'tighten their belts' and sign off benfits they are contractually obliged to while company directors and bankers pay themselves dividends and moan about how much tax they pay is a bit shit. Its certainly not the fault of teachers is it? Its already been shown that even the Conservative projections for pension costs are wrong, and that the cost of pensions is set up to reduce over the years, not cost more and more.

Thirdly, if what you want is higher pay, argue for that, not pensions as some sort of vague compensation.

As far as I'm aware, they're arguing for the same pay rather than a pay cut, which is what they're experiencing at the moment.

Fourthly, if you want public support, don't strike while negotiations are still on-going. You just lost the moral highground.

The government has already stated that the negotiations won't change anything.

Dan the sole point of private sector jobs is to make shareholders richer. Providing pensions doesn't make money so they don't do it. If you want a public sector style pension, work in the public sector, for the people rather than the MAN!

Blaming the bankers for everything is overly simplistic. But suggesting that public sector workers need to shut up, 'tighten their belts' and sign off benfits they are contractually obliged to while company directors and bankers pay themselves dividends and moan about how much tax they pay is a bit shit. Its certainly not the fault of teachers is it? Its already been shown that even the Conservative projections for pension costs are wrong, and that the cost of pensions is set up to reduce over the years, not cost more and more.

As far as I'm aware, they're arguing for the same pay rather than a pay cut, which is what they're experiencing at the moment.

The government has already stated that the negotiations won't change anything.

Most private companies aren't publicly listed, so they don't have shareholders, so they aren't about making them richer. Private companies include a massive amount of small businesses, which create jobs, and pay massive taxes which provide income for the public sector.

I do work 'for the people' (I serve people, and I am good at my job, which I take seriously) as do millions of people in the private sector.

Whatever the projections, pensions are a massive stone around young people's necks. There is a huge demographic crisis facing us, and it's going to get massively worse. There's no way that the pensions system can handle the average age rising into the 80s and way more people living more than that, maybe spending 10 years in care homes. People are never going to be able to provide for 30+ years of retirement, including maybe 10 years of invalidity. The Government doesn't have the money either. We are all fucked. The only solution is working longer. Unless you want to talk about mass acceptance of euthenasia, or 90 year olds moving back in with their children (or even grandchildren!) It doesn't really matter whose fault it is, ultimately, as whoever's it is, isn't going to be held responsible, or magically solve the problem.

I would be in favour of parity in pay and conditions between private and public sectors, but there are few instances where both provide the same things, so comparison is difficult. I don't necessarily buy the sweeping generalisation that public sector workers earn less than private sector workers. It's not comparing like with like. Many private sector workers are experiencing pay cuts, so right now, that would be parity. It can't make sense for a struggling private sector which is making cuts to fund the growth of the public sector. The money has to come from somewhere.

Most private companies aren't publicly listed, so they don't have shareholders, so they aren't about making them richer. Private companies include a massive amount of small businesses, which create jobs, and pay massive taxes which provide income for the public sector.

We all pay taxes, even teachers and nurses.

I do work 'for the people' (I serve people, and I am good at my job, which I take seriously) as do millions of people in the private sector.

I'm not doubting you are excellent at your job, I apologise if it came across that way. But this is more of an ideological point about the private sector as a whole, not you individually.

Whatever the projections, pensions are a massive stone around young people's necks. There is a huge demographic crisis facing us, and it's going to get massively worse. There's no way that the pensions system can handle the average age rising into the 80s and way more people living more than that, maybe spending 10 years in care homes. People are never going to be able to provide for 30+ years of retirement, including maybe 10 years of invalidity. The Government doesn't have the money either. We are all fucked. The only solution is working longer. Unless you want to talk about mass acceptance of euthenasia, or 90 year olds moving back in with their children (or even grandchildren!) It doesn't really matter whose fault it is, ultimately, as whoever's it is, isn't going to be held responsible, or magically solve the problem.

Actually, projections show that the current system for the people that have currently signed up for it is sustainable, new employees don't get the same pension as existing workers, that's already been changed. This concerns people that signed up 30 years ago and are now being told it will change for them. I agree newer workers like us will have to work longer, but people approaching 60 shouldn't have to do that yet.

I would be in favour of parity in pay and conditions between private and public sectors, but there are few instances where both provide the same things, so comparison is difficult. I don't necessarily buy the sweeping generalisation that public sector workers earn less than private sector workers. It's not comparing like with like. Many private sector workers are experiencing pay cuts, so right now, that would be parity. It can't make sense for a struggling private sector which is making cuts to fund the growth of the public sector. The money has to come from somewhere.

I would be in favour of equality in pay too! Many public workers accept the lower pay because of the benefits they receive. If these benefits are removed, who will work in the public sector? Who will do the jobs that need doing but don't make any profit, so can't be privatised? Thats a rhetorical question....

Prove to me that public sector workers get paid less. There are loads of jobs that don't have private sector equivalents. If private sector people work to 65 (which is already starting to look too young with people living into their 90s), then so should private sector workers.

Baby boomers are going to ruin our lives with their cushy pensions, and we're going to get nothing. The system worked when they signed up and it doesn't anymore. Either they pay for it, or we do. Generation war is on the way.

I was sat in a school two weeks ago and the female teachers were talking about what shopping they were going to do with their extra day off, I had to walk out of the staffroom before I exploded.

lol @ the thought of Ben in a union. lol with a side order of sad

Prove to me that public sector workers get paid less.
...
Baby boomers are going to ruin our lives with their cushy pensions, and we're going to get nothing.
The system worked when they signed up and it doesn't anymore.

1. Compare the salary of a teacher at a King Edwards Private school and a Birmingham State school. That is a like for like comparison and not only do the public sector workers get less pay, they also get WORSE pensions.
   
2. Baby boomers are retired now, the attack on pensions is an attack on people currently saving for their pensions.
   
3. Just keep ignoring the fact that public pensions' cost has peaked this year and is going down, so while you would expect that "The system worked when they signed up and it doesn't anymore.", it does still work and even the conservatives don't argue with that.
   
   

Basically it's an attack on anyone who can't afford private school by trying to lower any other schools to crowd control (I already took a 10k pay cut for this job, cut my salary by 10%? I'm not that stupid, I'll go earn 5 times my current wage in the city). Can you imagine 68 year old primary school teachers?

As to striking while the talks were ongoing, the scottish red-haired rodent had already let slip that the outcome was decided against us and there's nothing like warnings of "if you strike we'll only make it worse for you" to underline the fact that this is not a decision born out of necessity, but rather out of political choice.