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@skipper
That's cool so thanks all for the advice. I'll give 'em a go. Either way Open Pro are p'raps my favourite rims and @skunkworks, got myself a Principia Track Jet frame as well in the end. Waiting to build it up too but got some Time forks and Time seatpost, deda pista bars, newton stem, SMP composit saddle......getting there, getting there...............Principia in the heyday are just the finest alu frames made methinks.