Anarcho-Bicyclist Conference Manchester April 2011

A privy, yesterday.

It was a difficult shit to flush, took some manual 'mincing'.

Surely that is simply a representation of the abandonment of the traditional state orchestrated infrastructure and the adoption of a self help solution.

Say "no" to the sewerage system! Take waste into you own hands!

Are you talking shit Clive?

If that's what you want to call the produce created by the labours of working people, Will. My beef is with the system that deals with that produce.

My beef is with the system that deals with that produce.

So is my lamb korma

This is meant to be a vegan thread.

Don't worry i had brinjal bhaji on the side

complete and utter bullshit....how the fuck is lining the pockets of the rich in line with anarchist thought?......Thatcher and her fellow Chicago School of Economics devotees are all about concentrating power and wealth ever more in the hands of an elite.....the exact opposite of all that Anarchists espouse.....Crisis Capitalism in full effect...

Too right - it's presented as this chaotic 'anyone has a chance' capitalism, but really she used authoritarian state power and direct violence to line the pockets of the crony-ist classes. It's a libertarian wet dream to believe otherwise.

I can't wade through all that Mr Skull has said, but I found the observations about Egypt informative. Do you think that the sort of spontaneous order, that prevailed when publicly-minded militias seem to have condensed from nothing like bubbles in a fizzy drink, suggests that anarchism -statelessness - is immediately questioned when people will some order to exist in ad hoc ways - such as there in Egypt, or in the traffic-light example - that people desire order over 'chaos' so that statelessness can't really persist?

I don't really get that impression; isn't it more that given the opportunity, ordinary people demonstrate that systems of command and control are not neccessary for the smooth running of society - but are rather only a requirement if that society is run coercively in the interests of a minority? Don't conflate the idea of state with that of society - the latter is necessary, the former is probably just some made up bullshit.

So who's going to this thing then?

Sadly I can't. Cycling that weekend. The revolution will have to wait.

I'm going to miss it too. Does anybody know if the revolution will be televised?

I don't really get that impression; isn't it more that given the opportunity, ordinary people demonstrate that systems of command and control are not neccessary for the smooth running of society - but are rather only a requirement if that society is run coercively in the interests of a minority? Don't conflate the idea of state with that of society - the latter is necessary, the former is probably just some made up bullshit.

Agreed, I read Skully's post as containing the almost immovable (and erroneous) idea that anarchism = chaos or [society = order] + [state = society] therefore statelessness = disorder.

This line: "People desire order over 'chaos' so that statelessness can't really persist" - suggests he is equating statelessness with chaos, but the example given (Egypt / traffic lights) say the very opposite thing.

The problem that won't seem to go away is that whenever anarchism is discussed it seems to serve as a placeholder for 'chaos'.

If we go to the Wikipedia page on anarchism (it's long and boring with hundreds of footnotes / references) - and do a search for the word 'chaos' amongst the eleven thousand three hundred and forty three words on that page (thanks to online word count) - nowhere does the word 'chaos' appear, or 'disorder' or anything like that, for the same reason the word 'pedophilia' doesn't appear on the Wikipedia entry for socialism or 'levitation' appears nowhere in the lengthy entry for conservatism (7525 words).

When I imagine anarchism, I see London with the buses running as usual, people texting and Inception on at the Odeon Haymarket, I imagine going for a drink afterwards and then getting home, by taxi, not too late as I have to be up early to drop some cash off at my Landlord's house and then get to my job as a designer/banker/engineer/dress maker/receptionist/nursery worker - but if you discuss anarchism with most people it's hard to break free from the gravitational pull of Mad Max, burning tyres and leather trousers (with studs in).

When I imagine anarchism, I see London with the buses running as usual, people texting and Inception on at the Odeon Haymarket, I imagine going for a drink afterwards and then getting home, by taxi, not too late as I have to be up early to drop some cash off at my Landlord's house and then get to my job as a designer/banker/engineer/dress maker/receptionist/nursery worker - but if you discuss anarchism with most people it's hard to break free from the gravitational pull of Mad Max, burning tyres and leather trousers (with studs in).

or vegetarian food, knitting your own yogurt, freecycling, anti capitalist, dungaree-feminism, facepainting etc.
because that's the kind of thing that comes free with an anarchist-cycling conference.

or vegetarian food, knitting your own yogurt, freecycling, anti capitalist, dungaree-feminism, facepainting etc.
because that's the kind of thing that comes free with an anarchist-cycling conference.

Absolutely, anarchy (certainly in Europe) seems to have gathered around it a culture that is more concerned (or at least associated) with exactly those kinds of things you list.

I am not saying there is anything wrong with knitting your pudding only that embroidery as a condiment is no part of the political philosophy known as anarchy.

I would have thought that leather trousers with studs in could be quite uncomfortable. It depends where the studs are i suppose.

Sorry i'm late...
Seems like no one is talking about the event, i'm going to form a breakaway militant faction and actually talk about that.

1. What do people think about a syndicalist organisation/co-operative that could have collective purchasing power dealing directly with manufacturers to reduce the cost of parts and tools for it's members?
   

Seems like no one is talking about the event, i'm going to form a breakaway militant faction and actually talk about that.

Thank fuck for that, at last...

Wouldn't be more appropriate to liberate the parts and tools and redistribute them among those that need them?

1. What do people think about a syndicalist organisation/co-operative that could have collective purchasing power dealing directly with manufacturers to reduce the cost of parts and tools for it's members?
   
   

Sounds ace. Sounds like it would kill shops.

distributors wouldn't give you an account because the volumes would be too small and their bigger customers (shops) wouldn't like it.

^ why small? There are loads of bike recycling projects/shops in the uk if they formed a federation they'd be bigger than most shops. Local bike shops would be welcome to join.
However if the your local bike shop was run by its workers they'd get better wages and profits would go back into the shop making stock better and/or cheaper.
Bike shops have to deal with distributors who levy a charge anyway and there are several companies that use 'grey imports' (on-one, merlin).

It would be fully mutual and run for the benefit of the its members and the community. le click
Also you guys heard of Orbea and Mondragon?
Further reading on financially viable worker self management.

distributors are seen as essential to manage the brand in that country (warranties/promotion etc) manufacturers are not going to bypass a distributor directly. merlin on-one get round this by being a manufacturer of bikes.
Brixton Cycles are a workers co-op but to get a chain of those together and supply them outside the distributor network would require staff/warehousing/transport etc, a bit like a distributor really.

1. What do people think about a syndicalist organisation/co-operative that could have collective purchasing power dealing directly with manufacturers to reduce the cost of parts and tools for it's members?
   
   

Our company cycle Training UK is a worker's coop owned and run by around 50 cycling instructors. We have trade accounts with a variety of companies both supplies for work projects and co-op members.

We have improved out engagement with members and improved our decision making processes by agreeing collectively where decisions are made allowing some people to make decisions within their area of expertise, we agree strategic decisions using consensual decision making tools. It works really well and we have managed to maintain a degree of member's commitment and enthusiasm not often found in other businesses

Wouldn't be more appropriate to liberate the parts and tools and redistribute them among those that need them?

I think you are confusing anarchy with communism.