Overtaking Cars - Legal Status

Similar thing has happened to me, I think it's unavoidable that situations like this will occur in London traffic... I'm a lot more cautious now and assume that there is a car about to kill me coming from of every side road in London... You can't be too careful...

<>Insert bike pushing jibe here</>

I think that providing I was in the left lane, I would have right of way but it seems unclear what happens when you move into the oncoming lane.

Dunno how this applies, but I had advanced car training from a former motorway copper years ago and we were driving winding roads. He pointed out that there is nothing wrong or illegal with using the 'wrong' side of the road if it is done correctly and increases your safe use of the road. His example: When approaching a sweeping left hand bend on a clear road, creep into the right hand lane to widen your view of the road and straighten the lines out as you drive through the corner. We're not talking racing here, but sight lines and smoothness. His attitude was 'get over there and use it if there's no one coming the other way'. So I gathered that the entire road is there for your safe utilisation...

You should only overtake (filter) when it is safe to do so, if you can't see, it's not safe.
This applies to all modes of transport.

I think what I'm getting at is that there is often a time when the further out you are in the 'wrong' lane when filtering past traffic, the safer and more visible you are to cars pulling out from the left. Significantly more visible than to a car right turning across you when filtering along the left. I almost always feel safer down the drivers side of traffic when filtering (taking Stallion's opening gambit into account of course). What say you WiganWill?

Jaygee you forgot to mention the van that drove at you as you overtook traffic the other day. It is fun (not) to watch your husband's near-misses, this week has been interesting...

167

DO NOT overtake where you might come into conflict with other road users. For example

• approaching or at a road junction on either side of the road
  
  

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAndTransport/Highwaycode/DG_070314

There is some case law on this area and it is pretty common sense, thankfully.

If you are filtering on the wrong side of the road, you are putting yourself in a potentially hazardous position, so you need to take extra care. Therefore, if a cyclist is going too fast to avoid a car pulling out from a side road, through the stationary traffic, then the cyclist would usually be 50% liable for the accident.

The driver is also performing a potentially hazardous manoeuvre, as they cant see the bike filtering on the outside of the stationary traffic, so if they were not pulling out cautiously then they would usually be 50% liable for the accident as well.

I don't think overtaking on the wrong side of the road is any more dangerous than filtering up the inside. Certainly lessens the chances of hitting a pedestrian or having a door opened into you.

If you're passing a line of normal cars you usually have a very good view of what's down the road, be it someone turning out of a junction or whatever. Unfortunately there are so many chelsea tractors/vans/buses around the place that you need to be even more aware of what you can't see, because that's probably what will get you in trouble.

167

DO NOT overtake where you might come into conflict with other road users. For example

[*]approaching or at a road junction on either side of the road

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/DG_070314

Was about to post this too!

There is some case law on this area and it is pretty common sense, thankfully.

If you are filtering on the wrong side of the road, you are putting yourself in a potentially hazardous position, so you need to take extra care. Therefore, if a cyclist is going too fast to avoid a car pulling out from a side road, through the stationary traffic, then the cyclist would usually be 50% liable for the accident.

The driver is also performing a potentially hazardous manoeuvre, as they cant see the bike filtering on the outside of the stationary traffic, so if they were not pulling out cautiously then they would usually be 50% liable for the accident as well.

That's makes sense Oliver.
Doesn't the dotted line down the middle of roads have the same legal status as give way lines? ie it is alright to cross them but you don't have priority so oncoming drivers have right of way.

Both the overtaker and the driver pushing through the traffic jam have equal responsibility so need to negotiate. In situations where negotiations need to happen people need to move at a speed where this can happen... slowly

There are always clues as to what may be coming. If you're filtering past stationery traffic in the right of your lane (or even the otherside of of the road) most vehicles will be bumper to bumper. If you see a gap big enough to allow a vehicle through then expect a vehicle to to 'pop' out. If you can't see the gap you shouldn't be riding so fast.

Self preservation, innit.

The driver still has to look before pulling out, the "flasher" should not be trusted. When me & my mate got hit in exactly this situation the driver was found at fault (it wasn't a junction or side road but an entrance to some flats, she had been flashed out and pulled straight into the opposite lane without checking first) We were overtaking a long queue of stationary traffic, I remember getting a good look in the driver's window on impact, at the back of her head, she was looking the wrong way.

When overtaking a stationary or slow moving traffic do so slowly (only slightly faster than the speed of the traffic), when passing big vehicles such as buses check for pedestrians.

^ this

a very good debate this^

and some great advice.

i tend to overtake at a modest speed (10mph) stationary or slow moving traffic on the right, sometimes veering beyond the broken line and occasionally wrong side of small traffic islands.. but only when there is no oncoming traffic and knowing where the blindside (left) junctions are, never on unfamiliar roads. i feel safer in this location.

I had a similar incident, but in the inside channel. Car let a right turner through. It ended up with me upside down, still clipped-in as I few over the car's bonnet.

The police officer who drove me to the hospital said that it was a grey area, but if the car who let the other one through had flashed, it could be construed as illegally directing traffic.

The right turner refused to accept responsibility, as he said I had run into him! I would think it was more a case of him driving without due care and attention, crossing a lane of traffic blindly.

I wasn't badly injured and my bike was fine, so I didn't pursue it.

WHOAH! that's not a grey area at all. you were going down the left of the cars where bikes are expected to be. that cop was a piece of shit. the right turning car is clearly in the wrong - you cannot turn right unless there is a break in traffic in the opposite direction. there wasn't a break in traffic, there was you.

to the OP it would probably be the car's fault legally speaking, but when overtaking traffic on the right, you really should pay attention to the turnings and side roads on the left. and be going slow enough to react

Highway code says that you can't overtake at a junction.

or jump red lights, go the wrong side of traffic islands, ride on the pavement etc.

Ignore it all - but carefully!

OP- its got to be 50 / 50 responsibility hasnt it.

"I don't think overtaking on the wrong side of the road is any more dangerous than filtering up the inside. Certainly lessens the chances of hitting a pedestrian or having a door opened into you."

It is certainly less dangerous passing stationary traffic on the right, for three reasons

1. Drivers can see you in their rear view mirror/ oncoming drivers can see you clearly.
   
2. The likelihood of doors opening on this side is much less.
   
3. There is more room for drivers to yield to you, and you arent stuck in the gutter.
   
   

[QUOTE=Multi Grooves;1932394]There are always clues as to what may be coming. If you're filtering past stationery traffic in the right of your lane (or even the otherside of of the road) most vehicles will be bumper to bumper. If you see a gap big enough to allow a vehicle through then expect a vehicle to to 'pop' out. If you can't see the gap you shouldn't be riding so fast.

Self preservation, innit.

This^

More and more of our urban riding is going to involve this sort of riding,
with care filtering past queue nodders is no riskier than other riding in traffic situations.
as an aside, it seems to me that more and more drivers are yielding to me filtering past, moving in slightly to allow room, it just makes sense.
what do others find?

as the cars crept forward, one of them stopped to let a car pull out of a side road. He pulled out turning right just as I was a few meters in front of travelling quite fast towards him...

when overtaking traffic on the right, you really should pay attention to the turnings and side roads on the left. and be going slow enough to react

This is pretty much it isn't it, you've got to look for that break in the traffic and the junction. This has to be one of the most common error situations?
It got me when I was on a motorbike once. Learn from mistakes, which I guess you will now. Lucky you're ok.

.... If you see a gap big enough to allow a vehicle through then expect a vehicle to to 'pop' out. If you can't see the gap you shouldn't be riding so fast.

Multi grooves is spot on. Scanning the queue while passing it on the right is easier if positioned a car doors width away from from the stationary queue. Not only can you see better from here, you've got time to react if a pedestrian/driver pops through the traffic queue.

Multi grooves & Wicksie are spot on.

S'wot I said innit.
;)

Cheers Wicksie, that needed fixing;)

Another hazard is other cyclists or motorbikers deciding to filter down the outside but not looking before they pull out from between stopped cars. Before you move out you have to check that it is safe to do so. The faster you are travelling down the outside, and the closer you are to the cars, the less chance you have of being able to avoid anyone or anything pulling out.
Being able to filter down the outside is one of the great advantages we have as cyclists; it just needs a bit of caution and forethought.

It is certainly less dangerous passing stationary traffic on the right, for three reasons

1. Drivers can see you in their rear view mirror/ oncoming drivers can see you clearly.
   
2. The likelihood of doors opening on this side is much less.
   
3. There is more room for drivers to yield to you, and you arent stuck in the gutter.
   
   
   
   

This^

More and more of our urban riding is going to involve this sort of riding,
with care filtering past queue nodders is no riskier than other riding in traffic situations.
as an aside, it seems to me that more and more drivers are yielding to me filtering past, moving in slightly to allow room, it just makes sense.
what do others find?

This ^ again. I was passing on the right as I've found it a better place to be.

I second what you say about finding that more and more people will move over slightly to make room, but often I slow to a stop, pulling in to the queue of traffic. Whilst I appreciate the on coming car yielding to me, I don't always trust their judgement with how much room to give/speed to approach, and I don't want to anatagonise leave them thinking "stupid cyclist get out of my way". Whilst this view is obviously wrong, behaving in a considerate manner towards them will help to build positive relations with other road users (everyone seems to loathe the cyclist) and will hopefully mean that they behave in a courteous manner back.

This is pretty much it isn't it, you've got to look for that break in the traffic and the junction. This has to be one of the most common error situations?
It got me when I was on a motorbike once. Learn from mistakes, which I guess you will now. Lucky you're ok.

At the time I felt I was being quite careful, only moving out when there was no on coming traffic and trying to scan ahead. Evidently I wasn't and as you say, luckily I was ok. I'll definitely watch out for it more in the future, and filter up through traffic more slowly.

Learn from mistakes

Learn from other peoples' mistakes - it's far less painful