Atomic 22 / Infiniti 3D security system and skewers

wasnt sure wether to put this in the locks thread ( where it would get lost...) so started a new one

a complete bike security system a la Pinhead etc, made by/with Royce...heres hoping they make a Dura Ace stem cap...no doubt stupidly expensive yadda yadda

http://atomic22.co.uk/

can see the pricing on that being suitable if you are on a bike worth a few grand with top-end components but based on the price of existing security skewers etc the cost could easily outweigh any benefit for people on the more sensible end of the spectrum if they want to protect their whole bike.

would be interesting to see them pair up with otp manufacturers to provide them on the bikes from new.

I want to see what the pricing is like, I use pitlocks at the moment on seatpost and front wheel.
However because I need a 30mm seatpost collar, (which pitlock don't sell) I've had to jerry rig it to fit - it's not ideal. so if they do a variety of sizes for that sort of thing, I would be interested.

as i read it, there would be a unique "code" for each nut...so maybe you could start with, say, a pair of track nuts, then at a later date get a set of stem bolts or a saddle bolt coded to the same number???

and yea, im guessing theyre aiming more at the upper end.......mind , replacing Brooks saddles soon becomes an expensive hobbby...

(ive seen pitlocks removed with mole grips....pinheads seem a safer bet...)

i would never leave my "best bike" locked up anywhere in london so these would be pointless for me.

on the other hand, the track nuts look very good and i like the idea of being able to use the same tool for every component.

my 2p.

Saw the system at the bike show last year and they will be making coded key bolts for pretty much all of the removable bits of your bike. And yes you can start off with a couple of bits and then get more bolts cut for the others. At the time they said the price for wheels and seatpost bolt would be approximately the same as for pitlocks so £60. Definitely looking to purchase some as you could conceivably have the same key for all your bikes meaning that you could lock up safe in the knowledge that it would be extremely difficult for your bike to be broken down if stolen...

They presented a preview at the Cycle Show and pictures went online by quite a few folk including myself: http://www.flickr.com/photos/buro9/5068815539/ (start there).

The interesting thing is the completeness of the solution... down to brakes:

And just about every other bolt you can imagine.

At the time they were working to get the production costs down but had already fully proven the product.

For the equivalent of the pitlocks (skewers + seat bolt kit) they were aiming at the same price point. But clearly a set for a whole bike would be more expensive as you're getting more.

What I really liked was that it was thorough enough to even deal with saddle bolts:

It's basically a full solution, and that really provides a level of security above and beyond what anyone else is offering.

I've been waiting for them to be available to tell the world about them (the email list), but it's a great product and the couple behind it are really cool too... very friendly.

They suggested during the Cycle Show that they would be happy providing a set for a track bikes (they really are doing sets aimed at road bikes, track bikes, etc) for us to try out and then review. If that happens then some lucky sod will get a free set in return for a very detailed review... though whether you go so far as to bait a thief to test them will be a decision for the reviewer.

Whatever happened to these?!?

Let me check my inbox... he emailed a little while ago lost in the darkness of working his arse off to try and actually get to market:

I hope you are well and have enjoyed the summer?

The reason I'm writing is that we received an email from one of the guys on the forum re an update and we didn't want to traipse in to the community as a manufacturer and we aren't quite ready to announce over our 'newsletter' subscriptions so we figured the best idea would be to drop you a line.

We are still slogging our guts out at this non-stop and have suffered countless setbacks which have been difficult to take. In relative terms, we are practically there now but the small shortfall between current status and releasing product is always an inordinate amount of work.

After developing everything necessary, we moved out of Cliff's earlier in the summer into our own workshop outside Horsham to begin production proper but we have encountered umpteen problems with everything from the usual BT broadband debacle through to some very serious issues with our main CNC machine getting the sh#ts about being moved!

We've also made loads of refinements to products, all in all costing us another unplanned few months. We have made some solid progress with various things recently and we are hopefully now seeing some light at the end of a very long and dark tunnel. We won't put a date on this as there is always just so much to do and the seemingly most innocuous issues have a tendency to become significant hurdles. We appreciate that people are frustrated waiting but we are doing our utmost to get there. We hope the end result will be considered worth the wait anyway.

We haven't forgotten about Clefty and we'll drop her a line soon. Hopefully she's not a fair weather only cyclist so she'll still be able to give the stuff a go.

In the meantime, enjoy what's left of the fair weather!

tl:dr It turns out that the first 80% is 20% of the work, and the last 20% is 80% of the work. But they're slogging on.

Any further updates on when these might be available? They don't seem to be replying to emails sent through their web site.

They're officially up and running now I think, I've just placed an order for a seat binder among other things, I'll post again when they arrive let you knew how they are

Fantastic, been keen to hear how they are, and also want them to do well as their story is one of determination to bring it to market.

Yeah it does seem that way, you're right in what you said, they seem like really good guys, really helpful when it came to choosing the right part for the job, I'll post some pics etc when they arrive, hopefully next week.

Blimey, i didn't expect it to be cheap but 172£ to secure both wheels is crazy.
What's their target market?
Mamils on 5k bikes?

Jebus! That much?!? Got the email and was thinking about going nuts on my bike. The one I'm always wishing I rode more, but always worried about it getting stripped.

If they'll do a deal on a complete bike setup, I'd consider it. I'm going to haggle with them.

Blimey, i didn't expect it to be cheap but 172£ to secure both wheels is crazy.
What's their target market?
Mamils on 5k bikes?

Yep. Alan Sugar's Pinarello.

To be fair the wheel skewers are the most expensive part they sell, if you have an expensive saddle/stem it gets quite expensive to replace them if they get nicked and £50 for some piece of mind is worth it in my books

£172?

That make pitlock appear rather affordable.

£172 gets you 4 of these. Locking wheel nuts for solid axles, with a key. (which itself will be a proper tool, but I can't see a picture of one).
Unique and the ultimate security. There is definitely a market, I don't know if I am in it yet, but I am close!
I am trying to find a flaw, other than price, and can't see one.
You can't complain that nobody is taking bike security seriously, and the effort in getting this to market must have been enormous.

How much are you willing to spend to secure your bike?

1% of the value of the bike?
5%?
10%?
20%?

1% is too low... that's £10 for a £1k bike.

10% is spot on with current expectations, that's buying a Kryptonite when you've bought a £1k bike on the Cycle2Work scheme.

But as the value of the bike increases, the bike (and the component) desirability and the risk of theft also increases. I'd say that above £1k you're probably looking at 15% or 20% of the value of a bike.

So if you get to £2k for a bike and all of the components, then you're willing to spend between £200 and £400 to secure it. That's well within the Atomic22 price range.

When you're over £3k then you really can do the whole bike within the acceptable range.

If you've got yourself a lightweight bike, or some expensive MTB and don't want to carry extra security stuff... now factor in that all of this security will be on your bike by default and only weigh fractionally more than the regular bolts.

It's expensive as security goes, if your bike is below £1.5k. Once you're over that it makes more sense... pass £3k and it's a no-brainer.

And it's not like you need to get the whole system. For most of inner London just securing your saddle and using a couple of Kryptonites will deal with the most common opportunistic theft.

I think it's fine... yeah it's higher than Pitlock, but it's a more comprehensive and bespoke security solution than Pitlock. One key for all of the locks on the bike, and many of the locks made for your bike and the components on your bike.

^i do agree with that
It makes sense when you have 3k bike or even more expensive, but i don't think i'd like to leave over 3k bike secured with atomic anyway as it wouldn't stop people trying to nick it and possibly doing some damage to it

I might be wrong but i was thinking that most of the people would like to secure this way their good everyday rides.
Not pub bikes, not best bikes, but those with decent components between 1-2k that are used for commuting etc.

It'd be nice to have something like a package securing wheels, fork+bars and saddle+seatpost or maybe some other bundle deals
Atm i'd have to spend over 300quid to get that and that's expensive

And yes, 10% would be spot on

I looked at these when they previewed last year and still think they look great. Although it is perhaps a discussion for the locks thread, would fitting a selection of these parts remove the need for more than one lock? If the answer was yes, then I think it becomes a more attractive proposition. ATM, I do a lot of day to day stuff on a proper clapped out beater. I have no problem leaving it locked outside the gym, Sainsbury's, central London shops etc. It is heavy and a pretty crap ride, but I gain great enjoyment from the fact that I can go most places and not really worry about my bike. I am in the process of rebuilding a Mercian frame into a really nice ride. If fitting some Atomic22 parts meant that I could continue to have a lock and leave policy with only one lock policy then I think that would be a good thing. Carrying two Kryptonite locks may offer great security, but their weight makes it a pain and removes some of the convenience of nipping out on a bike.

/my2p

I might be wrong but i was thinking that most of the people would like to secure this way their good everyday rides.
Not pub bikes, not best bikes, but those with decent components between 1-2k that are used for commuting etc.

I agree.

But then you don't need to go down to securing chainrings and brakes... you need to make sure that the components most likely to be targeted are secure.

I reckon the entry level is just saddle and 1 wheel. You're probably already putting your U-lock through the other wheel and frame afterall.

Yes, who wouldn't want the whole system. But you'd only value the whole system if the bike value was crazy.

how would the weight of a whole system affect the overall 'weenieness' of a top end bike though? could end up being counter-productive to having spent all that money on the bike in the first place.

how would the weight of a whole system affect the overall 'weenieness' of a top end bike though? could end up being counter-productive to having spent all that money on the bike in the first place.

not by much, and a lot less than an extra lock!
I have spent all morning thinking about getting some, and I have thought of some problems.
Secure the stem and the bars can still be cut (I have seen whole sets of bars go missing with the shifters) I can't see how that would be stopped

Secure the saddle and they can cut the seatpost, etc
but I still love the concept, I mean just look at this:-