Narrow bars and leverage

So I've just got my first SS road bike and its taking a bit of getting used to, coming from a MTB background. The main "problem" I'm facing at the minute is the narrow drop bars. They're great for sitting down riding, but for getting up hills standing up it feels like I can't get enough side-to-side leverage if that makes sense? With my mtb's ridiculously wide bars I can just swing the bike side to side easily which makes getting the leverage to pedal much easier.

Does my technique need adjusting? I find I can get the best leverage on the hoods, riding on the flat portion of the bar is useless and drops feels so awkard.

on the drops out the saddle is a personal favourite (but probably wrong for one reason or another).

on the hoods is how most people climb - it looks that way on the tour anyway.

Swinging the bike is less efficient than keeping it steady. Pro riders only do it when they are on the ragged edge.

Oh right! When standing up to pedal I've always swung the bars/bike side to side, probably a bad habit since childhood then. It just feels easier than keeping it steady to me, suppose it's less controlled though. Is the technique to pull up on the hoods rather than swing sideways?

Used by the best, accept no alternative.

you mean used by me mmccarthy ;)

I never use the drops (yet) so I was thinking about getting some like that, looks better as well. Is there any difference between that and just riding on the hoods though?

not really. That's the point of them.

Yes, pull on the hoods. Swinging side to side just uses more energy with no gain.

I personally stay seated for almost all climbs so don't pull on anything, just get myself back in the saddle and do it all with the legs.

you mean used by me, mmccarthy ;)

Agreed.

Yeah, pulling on the hoods. Unfortunately there aren't any hoods on a lot of fixed gears that just have track drops and a cross lever. Then you just suffer...

A mate of mine who's a keen MTBer swapped the drops on his Fuji Track because he prefers climbing with wide risers (he rides a fairly high gear as well). They are massive, but it works for him.

BMMF wrote an excellent post on climbing technique. Search for it.

BMMF wrote an excellent post on climbing technique. Search for it.

Thanks, will do :)

IIRC, Fausto Coppi said that when climbing one's hands should be a light on the bars as a pianist's on the keys.

None of us are close to his level of course, but I do find that on hard climbs, thinking explicitly of relaxing the arms and upper body helps one concentrate the energy where it will do the most good. Thus, one really shouldn't need all that much leverage, and looking at say Wee Bert he certainly doesn't seem to be wrenching at the bars when climbing.

I think needing to pull on the bars is down to fixed gearing being higher than you would normally choose for a climb. Or if you're accelerating. Once in the groove it's definitely about sitting down and keeping a rhythm, especially riding geared.

Climbing on the hoods allows a change of stress on muscles and also allows more power from the arms. It is less efficient than sitting down, but some of each allow an overall increase in performance especially if you stand to push over increased gradients that come at certain points on a climb (rather than changing down), or to attack in a race and accelerate, before sitting down again.

You need handlebars that are shoulder width (measured shoulder joint to joint), if they are to wide or too narrow you decrease leverage (out of the saddle) and/or decrease aerodynamics (sitting).

You cannot climb efficiently on the drops in any circumstance. Drops are only for sprinting (which may be uphill - but only when you want maximum power and are not concerned about the anaerobic deficit - which will only be true if you are at the end of a race or have a long downhill stretch to recover) ... or at high speeds on the flat or downhill when you want maximum aerodynamics (but this can be achieved almost as completely on the drops if you have the right position).

Hope this helps - but not really important for pootling/couriering around town - just do what is comfortable.

You can hold the horns of a drop bar and enjoy much of the same climbing leverage afforded by hoods.

But it sounds like you may just need some wider handlebars.

bars ideally should be equal or greater than the width of your shoulders measured from centre to centre of joints.
i'm 44cm wide and i find anything narrower to cause the problems you describe.
I once had 38cm bars (cos they look way cooler, and i knew no better), and they were useless for me, climbing, and anything that requiring bar anchorage. Basically by having my arms angled inwards towards the bar, it took away any leverage i had.

God only knows how these hipsters on super narrow bars ride around town. Must be quite uncomfortable.

I think needing to pull on the bars is down to fixed gearing being higher than you would normally choose for a climb. Or if you're accelerating. Once in the groove it's definitely about sitting down and keeping a rhythm, especially riding geared.

this is it. i'm aware its better to be in the saddle for maximum efficiency but when ascending i generally find that the extra power from torquing the bike side to side with my arms is needed to actually keep on going as i push a reasonably big gear(85 GI). the fact that it's a lo-pro, with bullhorns, probably doesn't help either.

that's the joy of fixed gear though, unless you have a wonderful cadence range, your gearing wont suit everything.

I use bull horn bars and find them perfect for climbing. I agree with several of the posts above - choosing bars that are of the same (or at least very similar) to your shoulder width.

Anything other than a gentle slope and I usually get up out of the saddle, it does use more energy than sitting, but it doesn't strain my knees! Also, although swinging the bike while climbing isn't very good form, it does allow you to use your upper body as part of the leverage applied to the pedals, so unless you're worried about how 'pro' you look, or unless you have 'pro' thigh muscles, it may not be such a silly thing to do, especially on big hills.

Also, also, I gave up using a TT brake lever and now use a horizontal one, as near the centre as I can get, as I usually grip the bars in the middle (when not climbing that is)

**bars ideally should be equal or greater than the width of your shoulders measured from centre to centre of joints. **
i'm 44cm wide and i find anything narrower to cause the problems you describe.
I once had 38cm bars (cos they look way cooler, and i knew no better), and they were useless for me, climbing, and anything that requiring bar anchorage. Basically by having my arms angled inwards towards the bar, it took away any leverage i had.

God only knows how these hipsters on super narrow bars ride around town. Must be quite uncomfortable.

1+ on bold, as a rules of thumb.

I feel the same toward hipsters on super narrow bars, especially those Nitto track one at a mere 38cm, I should know I used to ride on those bar, it's no fun being very careful of potholes all the time.

Now I ride on 47c with the widest possible bar, potholes? I just ride over them, even no handed.

There's nothing wrong with the 'bar achorage' on 38cm* bars during a track sprint, and there are plenty of TT riders who manage to deal with potholes at >30mph with their elbows ~18cm apart and their hands ~5cm apart on aerobars.

*I don't ride this width on or off road, or on the track.

+1 for bull-horns for climbing.

I have some exactly the width of my shoulder bones (43cm C-C), and they work really well in all situations, save sprinting.

Wide bars are more for technically bike control, which on asfalt roads, should'nt be needed. My wide midge bars on the beater come into there own when the roads ice up though.

There's nothing wrong with the 'bar achorage' on 38cm* bars during a track sprint.
*I don't ride this width on or off road, or on the track.

I thought some trackies actually liked narrow (as in 2cm or so, less than ideal, as in maybe 38cm) bars for a better aero position and as they are possibly a bit stiffer.

Know feck all about track racing though, so might be speaking poo poo.

There's nothing wrong with the 'bar achorage' on 38cm* bars during a track sprint, and there are plenty of TT riders who manage to deal with potholes at >30mph with their elbows ~18cm apart and their hands ~5cm apart on aerobars.

I'm surprised you kept it this concise. So much wrong with this thread I think I'll leave them too it!