2010-03-09 - Rider Down/Fatality, Weston St x Snowsfield

Neil

They are bikes, painted white and locked near places where cyclists have been killed.

Thanks DJ.

Thanks DJ.

http://www.ghostbikes.org/london

Hay hi there people, i work for keltbray driving one of there tipper trucks and have been going to the shard site for over a year, i'm also a cyclist and ride to work everyday but i'd like to put it to you from a driers point , first of trucks will never be banded from rush hour times or made to work at nighs because off the cost, also no one wants a big truck passing down back streets but there not braking the law by doing so. also trucks have digital tacos that record speeds and time spent driving, the police have told us the truck was not speeding and the guy on the bike had head phones on and never stopped at the give way at the junction where he was killed, and after viewing the cctv they think he never looked because he didnt hear the truck coming, the first the driver knew off any thing was when the bike hit the front and then it was to late for this poor guy.
Also as a lorry driver i get the hump with bikes when there is a bike lane and bikes dont use them, also when we come to traffic lights how they come up the inside to get to the front!!! when the lights go green as hard as you peddle the truck will be moving faster and having to over take a bike again is puts the bike rider in danger , then you come to another set off lights and the thing starts over again, i think thats why driver dont like cyclist, yeah i think some drivers are dicks and rude but we have to use the roads together, i think if everyone who rides a bike never come up the inside off a truck 90% off deaths wouldnt happen, most do when the truck turns left and this would cut that out, i would invite anyone to spend half a day with me driving and get to see things from where we are and what we can see and get to see what some cyclists are like, i know my grammer and stuff aint the best but i wanted to say something on this case

Sorry to hear your fellow driver had to go through this, the views the lorry is in the wrong always come out on cycling forums, it's mostly frustration.
It's awful news this cyclist was out riding with headphones, cycling in the city isn't a trivial matter.

also sorry Oliver responded to you, you could be here a while ;)

Where would you like to see cyclists at junctions when in the lorry? do you think Boris allowing them to pass through out of the way when the light is red would help?

Or would you prefer them in the outside lane? behind you?

Also as a lorry driver i get the hump with bikes when there is a bike lane and bikes dont use them, also when we come to traffic lights how they come up the inside to get to the front!!! when the lights go green as hard as you peddle the truck will be moving faster and having to over take a bike again is puts the bike rider in danger , then you come to another set off lights and the thing starts over again, i think thats why driver dont like cyclist, yeah i think some drivers are dicks and rude but we have to use the roads together, i think if everyone who rides a bike never come up the inside off a truck 90% off deaths wouldnt happen, most do when the truck turns left and this would cut that out,

They're called Cyclist Advance Junctions and they have been put in place for the safety of cyclists.
It's obviously a fact that vehicles go faster than cyclists and I think in order for us to get on, it would help if you didn't get the hump because you have to over take us all the time.
I don't mean you, I mean the majority of vehicle drivers. They should put themselves in our shoes as much as we should yours. But the fact is, as I had to explain to a tipper driver, we're the vulnerable ones here.

#Notarsey.

Riding with headphones?? Beggars belief

Riding with headphones?? Beggars belief

Driving with music blaring out of the radio?! beggars belief!

If another idiot whinges about cyclists listening to music i'll mutter something to myself

do you think deaf people should be allowed to drive or ride a bike? If so then why can't someone listening to music?

Edscoble is a good example of someone with limited hearin who is perfectly safe on a bike. There are many more idiots with fully working ears who are a danger to themselves.

It's like the cases where someone is crushed to death but with no head injuries but the inquest still tries to apportion blame to the cyclist for not having a helmet on.

If another idiot whinges about cyclists listening to music i'll mutter something to myself

do you think deaf people should be allowed to drive or ride a bike? If so then why can't someone listening to music?

Edscoble is a good example of someone with limited hearin who is perfectly safe on a bike. There are many more idiots with fully working ears who are a danger to themselves.

+1.

I won't do it personally, although I used to, but I know people who I consider to be good riders, who do it. Personal choice. Although, I will not deny, I feel that it adds a further element of risk.

I personally would never listen to music whilst cycling
DJ. I would counter your arguments with the following.

When driving, you do not rely on your ears for traffic coming behind you as you have mirrors, so having a radio on doesn't matter.

As I am not hard of hearing or partially deaf I cannot speak for them. But, for someone who has good hearing and who always has, I have never had to learn to live with not having my hearing as one of my senses. if I get on my bike and blast music into my ears. I am cutting off one of the senses that I rely on everday and have never learned to live without. I use my ears when cycling to tell me when a motorcyle is flying up behind me, or if a car is creeping along in my blind area. Yes you should always look first, but as everyone here knows. Bikes are so manouverable and quick that sometimes you just zip from left to right or out of a junction without fully looking. I do this very often, and I rely 100% on my ears when making these moves.

As a pretty experienced London rider, I have no doubt that if I was to ride listening to music, I would have an accident pretty quickly.

This is my view. Feel free to shoot it down.

Regardless of any of this. Its a terrible tragedy and thanks to Murphy for giving us a view from the other side of the debate

All I'll says is this; your eyes is a much more reliable witness than your ears, sound can be misleading.

If another idiot whinges about cyclists listening to music i'll mutter something to myself

do you think deaf people should be allowed to drive or ride a bike? If so then why can't someone listening to music?

Edscoble is a good example of someone with limited hearin who is perfectly safe on a bike. There are many more idiots with fully working ears who are a danger to themselves.

It's like the cases where someone is crushed to death but with no head injuries but the inquest still tries to apportion blame to the cyclist for not having a helmet on.

The poor fella that died obviously wasn't using his eyes properly, maybe his ears would've helped. In this situation atleast....

You may well be right about what happened in this case, but it's best not to speculate at this stage. Finding out what exactly happened is the task for the inquest (much as even that is often unsatisfactory) and hearsay is a poor basis for this.

The poor fella that died obviously wasn't using his eyes properly, maybe his ears would've helped. In this situation atleast....

Hmmmm

Hmmmmm. Post # 90

"the police have told us the truck was not speeding and the guy on the bike had head phones on and never stopped at the give way at the junction where he was killed, and after viewing the cctv they think he never looked because he didnt hear the truck coming, the first the driver knew off any thing was when the bike hit the front and then it was to late for this poor guy"

Guys and Gals

is this the right place for this discussion? From experience we know that very often the families of those who have been killed come here thro google links etc

shall we move the actual debate to another thread?

Point taken - i've deleted posts.

This still is hearsay, isn't it? I think we shouldn't jump to conclusions until there is an inquest, just like Oliver said.

i went to school with haris, such a ridiculously nice guy. RIP.

Guys and Gals

is this the right place for this discussion? From experience we know that very often the families of those who have been killed come here thro google links etc

shall we move the actual debate to another thread?

This still is hearsay, isn't it? I think we shouldn't jump to conclusions until there is an inquest, just like Oliver said.

Completely agree, and can't be emphasised strongly enough.

do you think deaf people should be allowed to drive or ride a bike? If so then why can't someone listening to music?

Edscoble is a good example of someone with limited hearin who is perfectly safe on a bike. There are many more idiots with fully working ears who are a danger to themselves.

As I am not hard of hearing or partially deaf I cannot speak for them. But, for someone who has good hearing and who always has, I have never had to learn to live with not having my hearing as one of my senses. if I get on my bike and blast music into my ears. I am cutting off one of the senses that I rely on everday and have never learned to live without.

Mike has it spot on. Adjusting to disability, or never living in any other way, just means that you use other strengths. People sometimes assume that by putting on, say, opaque glasses, or ones with strange patterns on them to 'simulate' glaucoma, they can 'understand' 'what it is like to live with' certain disabilities. This is completely fallacious, as they obviously have no such period of adjustment.

Police where at the scene this morning at the same time this week asking for witnesses so an effort is being made.

that's a sad news...sigh...

I would like the driver from the lorry company to confirm if that lorry should have been travelling down Weston St.

Hay hi there people, i work for keltbray driving one of there tipper trucks and have been going to the shard site for over a year, i'm also a cyclist and ride to work everyday but i'd like to put it to you from a driers point , first of trucks will never be banded from rush hour times or made to work at nighs because off the cost, also no one wants a big truck passing down back streets but there not braking the law by doing so. also trucks have digital tacos that record speeds and time spent driving, the police have told us the truck was not speeding and the guy on the bike had head phones on and never stopped at the give way at the junction where he was killed, and after viewing the cctv they think he never looked because he didnt hear the truck coming, the first the driver knew off any thing was when the bike hit the front and then it was to late for this poor guy.
Also as a lorry driver i get the hump with bikes when there is a bike lane and bikes dont use them, also when we come to traffic lights how they come up the inside to get to the front!!! when the lights go green as hard as you peddle the truck will be moving faster and having to over take a bike again is puts the bike rider in danger , then you come to another set off lights and the thing starts over again, i think thats why driver dont like cyclist, yeah i think some drivers are dicks and rude but we have to use the roads together, i think if everyone who rides a bike never come up the inside off a truck 90% off deaths wouldnt happen, most do when the truck turns left and this would cut that out, i would invite anyone to spend half a day with me driving and get to see things from where we are and what we can see and get to see what some cyclists are like, i know my grammer and stuff aint the best but i wanted to say something on this case

5 days after this happens and some truck driver appears, treating my boyfriend's death like it is a point in support of his bugbear about cyclists? Instead of appearing apologetic and humble, as would be appropriate (he is after all, speaking as a truck driver, probably not unlike the one involved in the collision), he launches into a long rant and blames Haris!

Shocking. What an absolute twat.

Someone has already mentioned this, but moderators should be aware that family and friends of cyclists DO stumble across these threads, even when they have been forgotten by a lot of people.

hey claire, i am so sorry you are going through this x