G20 demonstrations

its a well known fact that the us has played a part in every major civil unrest in eastern eroupe, central and south america, aferica, and asia over the past 100 years. And I'm still right about their golas being to become more western, and more indurstrial, and certenly less comunist, kind of the oppisit of the goals of the people in question don't ya think?

Or, in the words of Harold Pinter in his nobel acceptance speech:

The United States supported and in many cases engendered every right wing military dictatorship in the world after the end of the Second World War. I refer to Indonesia, Greece, Uruguay, Brazil, Paraguay, Haiti, Turkey, the Philippines, Guatemala, El Salvador, and, of course, Chile.

I watched that shit on the telly because I'm not in London, what would you prefer me do? Get on the train and gauk at you miserable lot getting involved in "the action" and still come to the same conclusion?

Fuck that.

Judging by the coverage in the press (be it unbiased or not) I came to the conclusion that the people involved in the G20 riots were/are:

50% Soap dodging 'anarchists' who are on the dole
25% students trying to act like Vivian from the Young Ones
10% "Londoners" defending their city against The Man (even though you need The Man to live)
5% People with Digital SLR's gagging to get a good photo for their Flicker photostream
10% the sort of people who turn up to Critical Mass and bang on about the same shit every month

You can argue the toss of who threw the first punch that started the violence but the fact of the matter is there were trouble makers there looking for a fight and now they're crying because they got one. I say well done to the Police for getting heavy, shouldn't stand in front of a riot squad if you don't want to get roughed up. Way to go protesting against the current economic climate by adding a further +£7million to the Tax Payers bill, people.

The protesters looking for a fight deserved what they got. The peacefull protesters did not. The police (in my mind) are there should trouble occer. Not to insite it, wich was what I witnessed.

The police were making people delete any photographs/footage they had of the police, incorrectly using the anti-terrorist laws.

I'm disappointed if a few 'anarchists' couldn't disappear a couple of memory cards.
Youth today :)

I didn't witness any police deleting photos.

I watched that shit on the telly because I'm not in London, what would you prefer me do? Get on the train and gauk at you miserable lot getting involved in "the action" and still come to the same conclusion?

Fuck that.................

.......I say well done to the Police for getting heavy, shouldn't stand in front of a riot squad if you don't want to get roughed up. Way to go protesting against the current economic climate by adding a further +£7million to the Tax Payers bill, people.

So you believe everything you see on the BBC. Even though you agree that it may be biased. Well done!
I too saw it on the telly, and in person, believe me, its not the same.

Yeah, stop all protests because they cost the tax payer money. Thats a good strong argument there. Lets just all sit back and do as we're told. Makes life easier, doesn't it?
What did protesting ever achieve anyway?

1. if you want to fight with the cops i'm not going to stop you, but when they put you in your place, don't cry burtality. Did the police move a few lines seated protestros with sheilds and baton charges, yes. Where those people a few moments ago throwing mislies at the police, and at that moment faciltateing the destruction of a bank, yes.
   
   

At the Climate Camp, where I was, there were no missiles being thrown, and no banks being smashed up. But there was a riot police line that rushed a group of seated people.

Maybe you should attend one of these events before you tell people what happened.

I am not against protesting, but what we are seeing here is just a waste of time - why? because for all the guff about it engaging people etc etc, 90% of the British population does not relate to a bunch of yobs looking to smash sh!t up, or to a bunch of peaceful hippies building a camp in the city - in fact these peoples actions, even those such as the climate campers who were clearly well intentioned, probably do more to damage their aims because the majority of people see them as a bunch of fringe weirdos, and will never wish to be drawn into any association with them.

There is no doubt that the general populace needs to be engaged and brought into these discussions, but what we really need is a legitimate figurehead for this, and as far as i am concerned the best way to do this is to become involved in Politics, and use the system to your advantage.

We live in a day and age were Politics is dominated by career politicians who have been groomed/bought up in the closited world of whitehall and the civil service - what we need is real people with real world experience, who go into Politics to give back to society rather than further their own careers. Unfortunately in much the same way as the yobs on TV ailienate many would be protesters, the party machine robots we see on newsnight have the same effect in detering many from getting involved in the one sytem and institution were you can make a real differance, and tarnishes the image of those few Politicians who actually give a damm and are trying to move things forward.

The people being harrassed here seem pretty peaceable to me, unlike the uniform.

http://london.indymedia.org.uk/videos/993

This is an argument that can and will go on forever, Im sure.
But you can be surprised by what peoples opinions can sometimes be. The road protesters of the 90's; Newbury Bypass, Bath, etc were all seen as tree hugging, dirty, doley lazy scum, by many at first. But their protests changed the whole government road building program. Many, many new roads were scrapped because public opinion had turned to backing the protesters.

The people being harrassed here seem pretty peaceable to me, unlike the uniform.

http://london.indymedia.org.uk/videos/993

That was pretty brutal. Some serious baton action to people with hand in the air.

1. A. show me once comunist country that exists currently and has a population of over 2 million.
   
   

Loas, Republic of Vietnam, Peoples Republic of China, Cuba, Nicaragua, North Korea & i think the Republic of Moldova is still communist. All of these countries have populations well in excess of 2 million.

Some sates in India are also Communist run.

I run my house as a communist.

We are all equal, except for my girlfriend, she's even more equal than me.

In regard to the road protests, the actions of the radical protesters initially delayed getting together a proper protest movement, since the Local residents and politicians who also fiercely opposed many of the proposed roads, did not want to be associated with them, and as such there was a schism which prevented the full might of opposition being effectively utilized.

It was only when all sides managed to find a common route, coordinating political protest in the Commons with action on the ground, that the movement became effective, and managed to actually be a pretty good example of a protest movement involving all levels of society engaged in a common protest that made a real difference

The protesters looking for a fight deserved what they got. The peacefull protesters did not. The police (in my mind) are there should trouble occer. Not to insite it, wich was what I witnessed.

I suppose if I was a copper having to put up with the rules and regulations they have to do with in this day and age and having spent the last year being sworn at and given lip to by various inadequecies in society then I would relish the thought of legally being able to kick the shit out of someone. If everyone on here where lined up, armed and masked against a group of bike thieves protesting about the new Abus lock wouldn't you just love an excuse to kick the shit out of them, legally with no come back ;o)))

What did protesting ever achieve anyway?

improvement in juggling skills?

I like juggling

The people being harrassed here seem pretty peaceable to me, unlike the uniform.

http://london.indymedia.org.uk/videos/993

they were very peacefull and chilled out, they were offering the police drinks and food. all very smiley. to be fair that clip shows a few coppers doing the most damage. the rest followed becuase thats what you do.

lets hope all those with common sense are disgusted by the actions of the force they serve and choose to leave or take action.

some black hammerite sprayed into the visors would have made it interesting...

I like juggling

any good?

Unfortunately that requires people to be in charge of keeping things fragmented...which will only result in hundreds of people having to help them do so...before you know it, you're back to having a pseudo government again.

My idea was more one of adverserial checks and balances. In principle, similar to our system of government, but constitutionally entrenched and with more hostility between various bodies to ensure the checking process in significant and consistent. For example, when the Unions were broken during the 80's, all the influence they held was transfered to the CBI, a policy maintained under New Labour. Had the government tried to strike a just balance between the interests of employers and big business and those of employees rather than simply favoring one over the other in accordance with who posseses the greatest electoral clout, our economy may not have reached the dizzy heights that it for most of the 2000's, but we would be in a far better position now. Basically, we need to destroy and rebuild from the ground up.

I run my house as a communist.

We are all equal, except for my girlfriend, she's even more equal than me.

Hence the walking pig in your avatar, no doubt. ;)

Can i just add Oliver hasn't come back on my arguments so technically i have won..

DK can we make this a sticky - i'd like this moment to last.

I watched coverage of the protests on telly yesterday and it was sad.

Bunch of balaclavad/masked twats trying to cause trouble and protest against what exactly? Every single one who was interviewed live on the spot (thus being given a prime time opportunity to advertise their cause to the nation) and asked about what they were there for couldn't come up with an answer, "Er yeah we're just pissed off you know?" ...awesome cause guys, great work!

Whole lot of fucking idiots who deserve to be hit with batons if you ask me. If I was there I'd have joined the police lines.

CHUG_IT you are a fucking idiot, but we need people like you.

The police were making people delete any photographs/footage they had of the police, incorrectly using the anti-terrorist laws.

Yes, even if the anti-terror laws were applied correctly - then they still do not have the right to delete photographs.

Tynan did you get anything good on film?