Ben, I do agree that you have a valid opinion, but I think that voicing it this very moment is perhaps a bit hasty and that instead you could have chosen to be considerate to the fact that the family and friends of the girl that died may be reading the forum at the moment.
It is a wise thing when to know not to voice an opinion (no matter how valid it is), and I can't claim to being any kind of master of that wisdom as I recall trivialising 9/11 within hours and inviting a whole website to make "tsunami mixtapes" (Wave of Mutilation by the Pixies anyone?) a few days after tens of thousand of people had died.
I don't think there really is a valid position against what you are saying, indeed there have been a number of road deaths in the past and when it's firmly outside of your circle and reach it is hard to feel it's anything other than a statistic, so I can totally understand your position.
However, what you may well be under-estimating in this instance is the sense of community that this website has brought to London cyclists and the fact that for a lot of people this community extends to a lot of close friendships.
There are other factors too, such as how easy it is for us who class ourselves as more avid and experienced cyclists to dismiss statistics and to feel confident that it wouldn't happen to "us" (being the fixed gear cyclists with our smooth riding and feel for the road).
My first post in thread after the accident actually summed up both of these points... "I hope it's no-one we know". But it turns out to be someone we know... not quite my best friend, not a family member, but a girlfriend of someone who does belong to the community. This changes things, a lot. It's now someone within a few degrees of separation, it's someone that people on here know, it brings it a lot closer to home and that invincibility that we feel has just been shattered. No longer can we feel that we are immune, we aren't. We've had the strongest reminder possible that we are incredibly vulnerable.
Further, when grief is close anyone who has experienced loss empathises strongly with the person in grief, it is incredibly traumatic, as someone who has experienced loss several times I feel deeply for velcro.
On top of all of this, this is the first time this has happened within this community. It's new to this community, we have no precedent for coping and helping those much closer to Eilidh cope.
What I'm trying to say is that yes you have a valid opinion, but right now given the vast majority of the forum are in London and feel connected to this because of the sense of community and how that alters things... that feelings are running quite high about this and it's definitely a time for sensitivity and consideration. Just because you have a valid view does not mean that airing it is a good thing.
I don't think that anyone else should respond to you... this argument shouldn't be had now.
And I think that you'd do best just dropping it and walking away... your reputation won't survive fighting your viewpoint at this moment in time.
Ben, I do agree that you have a valid opinion, but I think that voicing it this very moment is perhaps a bit hasty and that instead you could have chosen to be considerate to the fact that the family and friends of the girl that died may be reading the forum at the moment.
It is a wise thing when to know not to voice an opinion (no matter how valid it is), and I can't claim to being any kind of master of that wisdom as I recall trivialising 9/11 within hours and inviting a whole website to make "tsunami mixtapes" (Wave of Mutilation by the Pixies anyone?) a few days after tens of thousand of people had died.
I don't think there really is a valid position against what you are saying, indeed there have been a number of road deaths in the past and when it's firmly outside of your circle and reach it is hard to feel it's anything other than a statistic, so I can totally understand your position.
However, what you may well be under-estimating in this instance is the sense of community that this website has brought to London cyclists and the fact that for a lot of people this community extends to a lot of close friendships.
There are other factors too, such as how easy it is for us who class ourselves as more avid and experienced cyclists to dismiss statistics and to feel confident that it wouldn't happen to "us" (being the fixed gear cyclists with our smooth riding and feel for the road).
My first post in thread after the accident actually summed up both of these points... "I hope it's no-one we know". But it turns out to be someone we know... not quite my best friend, not a family member, but a girlfriend of someone who does belong to the community. This changes things, a lot. It's now someone within a few degrees of separation, it's someone that people on here know, it brings it a lot closer to home and that invincibility that we feel has just been shattered. No longer can we feel that we are immune, we aren't. We've had the strongest reminder possible that we are incredibly vulnerable.
Further, when grief is close anyone who has experienced loss empathises strongly with the person in grief, it is incredibly traumatic, as someone who has experienced loss several times I feel deeply for velcro.
On top of all of this, this is the first time this has happened within this community. It's new to this community, we have no precedent for coping and helping those much closer to Eilidh cope.
What I'm trying to say is that yes you have a valid opinion, but right now given the vast majority of the forum are in London and feel connected to this because of the sense of community and how that alters things... that feelings are running quite high about this and it's definitely a time for sensitivity and consideration. Just because you have a valid view does not mean that airing it is a good thing.
I don't think that anyone else should respond to you... this argument shouldn't be had now.
And I think that you'd do best just dropping it and walking away... your reputation won't survive fighting your viewpoint at this moment in time.