Super-old Sturmey Archer hub overhaul

I got this old SA hub from my Grandpa, it came laced to a stainless steel rim, and I'm trying to overhaul it. However, I can't identify which type it is, so Sheldon Brown's articles are no use. I've taken out what I'm guessing are the magnets, but I am getting nowhere with the drive side. Can anyone tell what type this is, or even what I need to do next?

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Shell looks in really bad condition, but if you can find a model identification (which will be mostly letters) and a for digit date stamp (which will give you month and year of manufacture, then look here;http://www.sheldonbrown.com/sturmey-archer.html
Or here, http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~hadland/gear.html

Sprocket is held on with a circlip, my guess though is that it's not worth spending too much time or money on.

That's a dynohub, I imagine it'll just be based on the standard AW hub with the dynamo added on. If there is a standard model of dynohub I'd just assume it to be that. But SA hubs are very easy to get hold of on ebay, you're probably better off just buying a normal one in better condition.

Sorry, just re-read the OP.
Even though this is a dynohub the internals are much the same. Use the diagrams/ service notes linked to above.
Once you get the circlip off, then disassembly is fairly straightforward an you should be able to work out which model it is from the internals.
As I said above though, I'm not sure it's worth it

It's more a sentimental thing, would like my grandpa to see that I got it going again

Start here then http://www.hadland.me.uk/samaintind.htm
Or take it to Mog at Brixton Cycles. I think they charge about £30 for a strip down of an SA hub

Ive got a dynohub im planning to overhaul soon, wasnt sure what to expect inside tbh!

Ive never seen a SA hub with any real rust on it before , the chromes come clean off. If you manage to clean it up its just gonna get rusty again unless you paint it.

A lot of the orginal service manuals are available on the net, and odd spare parts on ebay. But its gonna be a labour of love.

Ye man, didn't realise what the dyno bit was until just now, but remember learning about how it works in physics. Thanks for the help. Can't work out the model because it's rusted off.

Just go on the offical website, sunrace the new taiwanese owners have done a great job putting old posters, manuals and history. If you try hard to get the rust of though you should be able to find a date stamp on the flange or hub shell.

Oh and, its not technically a dynamo like your probably learning about in physics There are no brushes. The dynohubs work in a more clever way, they have no friction and self regulate voltage which tops out before your bulb pops.

That is the 4 speed FG dynohub. It's the best kind, based on the FW. Other types are the AG (3 speed, based on the AW) and the GH6 - a front wheel dynamo.

Make sure you don't separate the dynamo from its keeper ring, or you'll kill it. Leave that bit alone.

The gearbox part will probably be in great condition - just need cleaning and fresh grease/ gear oil.

I have overhauled an AW 3 speed and that was all it needed. Magnificent piece of engineering. All the info I needed was on the sturmey heritage site. Tony Hadland's site is also a good resource - find it via Sheldon.

Watch out for small springs and bits flying about and getting lost, but other than that it's just a 3 dimensional jigsaw.

Make sure you don't separate the dynamo from its keeper ring, or you'll kill it. Leave that bit alone.

I may have done this - what's the keeper ring?

ps thanks for the info, that makes it much easier

Here's an exploded diagram
http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~hadland/sa/safg.pdf

I think it's GL603 and 343 that must not be separated, but I'd leave the whole dynamo assembly alone.

Also check out
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/sturmey-archer/ag.html
and http://www.sheldonbrown.com/sturmey-archer/fw.html
and here
http://www.hadland.me.uk/samaintind.htm

Was the rim a 26 x 1 1/4 dunlop?

^I don't know, it didn't have any stickers on it. How would I work that out?

just noticed the following engraved on the rim:

26x13/8 Reg No 832297 Raleigh Stainless 26x13/8

Ooh, 1 3/8's, would fit my BSA nicely. Are you going to be using the rim?

@Blowieben - keep the rim - you're going to need it to build the wheel. Finding 40 hole stainless rims these days is tricky

@RandomBadger, I have a pair of chrome-on-brass steel 'Westrick'-pattern built up wheels (i.e. they can be used with rod or cable brakes) They are both 36 spokes, made by Sturmey Archer and have Sturmey hubs, the rear being an AG 3 speed dynamo in perfect working order. They are in good condition, no rust, shiny shiny. Came off my Raleigh Superbe, made in 1974. Got tyres on them in decent enough condition too.

(I replaced them with a pair of stainless 40 & 32 spoke with an FG 4 speed.)

If you can pick them up from East London I'll take £80 for the pair.

They are on the bike in this pic
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t246/londonbabe_photo/IMG_0326.jpg

@Blowieben - keep the rim - you're going to need it to build the wheel. Finding 40 hole stainless rims these days is tricky

But finding 40h alloy rims is fairly easy. Trying to stop steel wheels revolving, particularly in rain, is a nightmare

"The gearbox part will probably be in great condition - just need cleaning and fresh grease/ gear oil."

Dead right. Are you sure it doesn't work? These things very rarely fail. 99% of apparent failures are due to poor adjustment of the selector cable. I have personally never known one go wrong internally, and I have one built in 1920 (definitely not SA's finest hour) and it still just purrs. As far as I know it has never been apart.

My grandpa used to take it apart, so god know's what he's done to it. Wanted to ger the hub shell on it's own though, so I could give it a proper clean

Ive seen weak springs, and I had one that someone had filled with grease, which made it not work very well. (only the ball-bearing cups should have grease in them. the internal parts use oil - either 80/90 weight gear oil or 40 weight car engine oil)

Have got the sprocket off, am now struggling with the 'RH cone locking washer'. It's a funny shape and I think that it's bent.

I may have done this - what's the keeper ring?

The armature probably includes some magnetically-soft iron to provide a low-energy path for the magnetic field lines to get between the north and south poles. Take this away and the same amount of field passing through air would have a lot more energy - more than the magnets can withstand, so instead they will re-arrange the magnetic fields within themselves to mostly cancel out, and so become much weaker. A keeper is a piece of soft iron placed between the poles of the magnet before or as the armature is removed so that there is always a low energy, high permeability path for the field, thus preventing the magnets becoming unstable.

(As you work against the magnetic field to pull the armature out of the magnet you add energy to the field. Use a keeper and the armature will be removed with much less force - the keeper being pulled in and helping to push the armature out.)

With the hub in the state shown (left-hand cone removed) the next step in dismantling it is to remove the thick spring wire circlip holding the sprocket on by prying at the three semi-circular notches.

To unscrew the right-hand-side of the hub (K60 in BlueQuinn's diagram) from the shell, apply rust penetrating oil to the join and leave overnight, then clamp the shell in a vice and tap sharply at the notches in the ball ring with the shaft of a cheap screwdriver and a hammer. The ring unscrews anti-clockwise, looked at from the right.

moth

Have got the sprocket off, am now struggling with the 'RH cone locking washer'. It's a funny shape and I think that it's bent.

It should just pry off, and that will allow you to remove the right hand cone, but not much more. I would leave the RH cone until you have removed the RH ball ring from the shell.