Bit confused?!

fuck you, hipster. i like my fixie.

fuck you, hipster. i like my fix.

Good for you, I managed to kick the habit a long way back... ;p

complete the following :

the fixie pixie made my chixie trixie

This bottom bracket shell is now the only thing i am not understanding. I've had the threads checked and they are not 26tpi that raleigh used but, they are 24tpi which was used when carlton was their own company.

All i am unsure of now is what BB to fit. A carlton corsa frame with 120 rear spacing and miche primato track hub (42mm chainline) and sugino messenger cranks. Stated length to use was a 103mm axle.

Being a 71mm BB shell, what approach do i take?!! I can work out everything else with chainline, just not sure which BB will give me the best adjustment. English threads by the way. (sorry if thas obvious)

Once i got this cleared up it's the home straight i think!!!

Let me know how you get on. I've got two Carlton's, a 1959 Road/Path and a 1982 Criterium.

I fitted a Sugino BB to the Road/Path without problems. I'm fairly certain the Criterium is 26tpi though, which means I'm going to attempt to keep the original BB and cranks, and hopefully get away with using chainring spacers to get a good chainline with a System-Ex rear hub

BTW Never, ever say fixie spits on Arrocock again... ;D

why's that then?

why's that then?

Cause some people have an irrational hatred of the word 'fixie'

oh right, they should get that seen to.

@ peahead1880: Have you tried screwing a different BB into the thread yet? I have two old Carlton frames, one has a 68mm wide shell and takes the ISO (British) thread (1963 Carlton Catalina), the other has a 71mm shell and takes the Raleigh thread (1975 Carlton Criterium). I would advise checking with another ISO BB (borrow if you can) before buying a replacement.

Also, if you put a 103mm sugino BB in the 71mm shell it may fit, but the centre line may be out. You may find the left cup screws in a long way if there is enough thread in the shell, otherwise the cup may not go in far enough to support the BB properly and the left crank arm may foul on the cup.

Facing could be the answer but is probably more expensive than the frame.

It will probably work out ok for you, but just check and double check what will fit before buying.

@Ste_S: Have you thought about a threadless BB (YST, and others available)? Cheap enough to try. I bought one of these for my Criterium but it was the wrong length for the cranks I had at the time. i intend to go down that route with the right BB length when funds permit again.

@Lurker103: Did you use "Rotafix" method to tighten the sprocket? If not, google it and give it a go. Make sure you use red loctite too if you're only running one brake.

Yeah I'd already done all of the correct googling and read up on rotafix. It's impressive how much flew you can get out of a wheel!!
I could only get the blue loctite at the time (red packaging, blue fluid) but if it comes loose I'll have t try the other one. I am still using both brakes though, as I have only been running fixed for a few days. I'm pretty sure I'll be keeping the front brake on a while.

I've got a 67mm BB shell on my 1980 Carlton Pro-am. Thread is definitely 24tpi and I've fitted a Shimano UN54 110 mm BB in there. Chainline isn't sorted yet as I don't have a hub (still building), but my LBS - who are fixed-friendly - measured it up and said it would be OK. I know my BB shell width is different to yours but just letting you know the Shimano BB will fit the threads and comes in different lengths. Dunno if this helps any...

@ChrisNW - Thanks for that. Looked it up on the YST website, looks as though they only do 68mm ? Have you seen a 71mm anywhere ?

@ChrisNW - Thanks for that. Looked it up on the YST website, looks as though they only do 68mm ? Have you seen a 71mm anywhere ?

I haven't.

I was considering a poor-man's facing, i.e. careful filing 1mm from the drive side. I'm pretty handy with marking off and filing but nervous about producing a consistent 45 degree chamfer that is square to the BB centre line - the YST BB works best if the shell is chamfered. If the drive side face ends up where it would be for a 68mm shell, this would put the BB centre at the centre line of the frame. I hope this makes sense.

Hmm, I'll think I'll measure up the chainline tonight and see if it's doable using the existing BB and cranks and with a few chainring spacers if needs be. The above method sounds far too involved for my pub/commuter bike ;)

Even the guy in the shop was surprised it was a 24tpi thread. Especially when i told him the date, which i worked out to be around '74'. As he explained, carlton used 24tpi before raleigh came around and changed it, bust most carltons had 24tpi pre '70's. I dont know if this is fact though.

I even wondered if it has been re threaded, as i here it is possible, although it leaves the threads slightly weaker.

I had a measure today and the chainline at the rear works out to be 42mm. Is there a way to work out what BB axle you should need, in theory, if you have the cranks and chainrings etc?

I'm wondering if the miche primato BB would be any cop, because i have read that it is adjustable laterally. Am i better off going for a cartridge BB or cups with ball bearing and axle. Or does it make no odds!!!

It's probably on a couple of mm out. It's pretty close. I'm having to use the inner ring on the chainset that I have, so I'm running 42/16 rather than 52/20. I'm just trying to keep the cost down as low as possible, so all I've bought to convert the bike is:
2nd risers = £5
track cog = £12
lock ring tool = £10 (although not really a cost to the bike as it is a tool that will last forever!
1/8 chain = £9
pedals/cages/straps = £7
pair of blizzrd sport tires = £18 ( got them in Sheffield so they're rather cheaper than London!
Total = £61 (inc. tool)

Not bad to completely convert a 22 y.o. Peugeot into a fixie!

p.s. although I could do with some new forks that will allow me to barspin

10 hours gone by and I've already got me some new forks :-)

peahead1880, cartridge BB all the way. Far less hassle.

Check out the "Transmission Database" thread on here. That will give you plenty options for BB and cranks.

I seem to remember reading somewhere that most of the cheaper Carltons from mid 70's onwards got made at Raleigh's Nottingham factory, these frames were assoicated with the Raleigh BB. Worksop (the old Carlton factory) was where they still made the higher end models, most of these frames used the British thread (which became ISO). I don't believe the corsa was top end, but it's feasible they made a batch of them there if work was slack.
Google for this info, you'll find some interesting stuff on Carltons if you look hard enough.

Amazingly, after I've measured it, the bottom bracket width is 68mm. Which I guess means it's 24tpi
? Felt certain it'd be 71mm/26tpi with it being a 1982 lower end Carlton.

Inner ring chainline is 41.5mm, can I get away with running it 1.5mm out from the 43mm at the back ? I'll probably end up with a new bottom bracket at some point in the future though now it looks as though it's 24tpi

I wouldn't imagine 1.5mm making much difference. I don't think you'd even notice. Most chains have far more side-to-side movement than that. For example: if you hold a chain horizontal instead of vertical it'll show you how much 'bend' it has before you use it.

Measure the flipping thread! There's at least half an inch of thread in a BB. 12 threads per half inch: 24 tpi; 13 threads: 26. Or work it out pro-rata. It ain't rocket science and it's better than making guesses based on hearsay and folklore.

Re where these bikes were built, Chris is slightly wrong I think - the high end bikes came from Raleigh's plant after about 1973. Carlton's Worksop factory shut in 1981, but was not quite the end of the line - if you knew the right people you could still get a top-notch Carlton out of the Raleigh plant, but these were pretty similar to the top-end Raleighs of the period. I have a 1986 genuine Carlton but a lot of people will tell you there was no such thing after 1980. W... frame number is supposed to mean Worksop but lots of Carltons came out of the Raleigh plant with W numbers. Really shit hot bikes - team and "works" bikes - were numbered SP and came from the Special Products division of Raleigh.

This is all rather academic. Raleigh or Carlton, the later ones were pretty good high-spec bikes. Most Carltons sold in the USA were badged Raleigh anyway.

The shop employee is wrong. It sounds like whomever you talked to is not familiar with converting a road bike with horizontal drops to a fixed gear road bike. Next time, you can use this opportunity to educate your mechanic. Bring in a friends bike, or print some photos to make it clear.

The shop employee is wrong. It sounds like whomever you talked to is not familiar with converting a road bike with horizontal drops to a fixed gear road bike. Next time, you can use this opportunity to educate your mechanic. Bring in a friends bike, or print some photos to make it clear.

for some reason nothing but the OP loaded the first time i looked at this post. my bad.

Amazingly, after I've measured it, the bottom bracket width is 68mm. Which I guess means it's 24tpi
? Felt certain it'd be 71mm/26tpi with it being a 1982 lower end Carlton.

Inner ring chainline is 41.5mm, can I get away with running it 1.5mm out from the 43mm at the back ? I'll probably end up with a new bottom bracket at some point in the future though now it looks as though it's 24tpi

1.5mm will be fine.

Lucky for you it's out the right way in the sense that if you want to 'straighten' your chainline at a future date, you can buy a wider BB without any risk of the chainring fouling the chainstay. 3mm wider BB should give you 1.5 chainline movement.

Also, shell width is no guarantee of thread pitch. Checking is best policy. I'm lucky enough to have a thread gauge that has 24 and 26tpi gauges, measuring by eye and counting threads makes my eyes go funny! However, I find the best way to count as deSelby says, measure out half an inch on the threads and mark the ends of the half inch with a pencil - in the grooves, starting one or two in from the outer face of the shell (end ones are sometimes a bit vague where they are worn) count the grooves with a pin; the first groove you marked is number 1, don't count the groove containing the other pencil mark or you will have counted too many.

@deSelby: I was writing that stuff about Carlton from memory, couldn't remember which site made the high end models. Thanks for the correction.

Interesting. It has worksop on the head tube badge.

So has mine. But deffo built at Raleigh.

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Well I took delivery of my good ole cotterpinned crank set and axle bb set up for a 26TPI frame this morning. It weighs a ton, feels like it's made of lead but as strong as titanium.

So peahead all is not lost if you do need to get kit for a 26