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@sidney
Tynan, thanks for that thread, I have checked all these bikes out on reviews, none of em got bad reviews, and their owners are all very defensive of their particular rides and rightly so, I just wanted to narrow the field down a bit, obviously cant cos they all appear to do wot it ses on the tin, obviously no duffers amongst them which was my biggest worry, ok £400 is cheap for a bike nowadays apparantly, not for me, I just didnt want to make an expensive mistake, sorry for my long winded writing questions and answering, but hey, its 0120 am, wot else you got to do, you love these big long essays, exercise the mind as well as your legs eh eh. I like them wheels on the Charge freestyler, but I likes the bars and saddle on the plug, do you think they do it deliberately in the hope that we would buy both? I think I got to have the charge, the surley and the tricross in me list, the tricross looks like a jack of all trades, the surley looks the buisness, and the charge is unique, 3 bikes one speed and all completely freekin different and mad in their own ways, arent mountain bikes really boring? Eh EH!