Spokes and stuff... how hard is this? Hard!

Cheers for the offer Dogs, I'm actually at uni in Edinburgh at the mo and have a mate up here who can build the wheel up for me (and hopefully teach me a little of the art). Do you think 290 would actually fit or should I go with the spoke calc?

spocalc, always seem to have them longer. i like to use fractionally shorter ;)

So 292mm is the order of the day?! Cheers Mr Balls, I hope you find a home for your spokes.

Hi Bernhard,

I agree with dogs. I used 290mm ACI spokes for my Formula/SystemEx/SJS/etc. hubs with Mavic Open Sport rims. I used spocalc to get the figure and the length was perfect.

Cheers Chris, I'll have a crack with the 290's then, gonna pick them up at the weekend and get them built up. All depending of course if the postman decides to walk up the stairs to the flat and deliver my hubs and stuff rather than just popping the little red slip through the door.

all

The above^ couple of posts suggests go shorter, but...

I have calc'ed that I need 292s for a build I am doing... using a calc that people recommend you round down by 1mm afterwards... hmmm 291mm not gonna happen... should I round down to 290 or stick to 292? This is for drive side on an assymetric geared hub, if that has any bearing.

290's fine :)

cheers dogs.

no probs, need a spokecard?

I use this spoke calc http://www.wisil.recumbents.com/wisil/spokes!.asp

You need crosses on the rear for torque transfer, go with three cross if this is your first build.It is common for a reason.
Enjoy.

surely a contradiction?

I did radial for my first wheelbuild, very quick and easy. Perfect for a front wheel.

Did 3x for my second, a rear wheel. Both turned out perfect, but crossed lacing inherently takes longer to finish.

In terms of the wheel ERD, it will often be listed on the rim website or in the spkecalc on the DTswiss website. Which will give you some accurate spoke lengths. But your spokes cab be quite a bit out and the build will still work as nipples can make up the difference.

WTF?!?
he means you learn all the essentials by doing a 3-cross and the fact most will have a spare wheel to compare.

sorry im not altogether! but radial or one-cross is definiteley much easier and very suitable for a front wheel.

suitable for front yes, but stiff

My post's a bit off thread as a result of newbie restrictions but i have a stupid question so what the hell. I'm in shanghai - most bike shops know nothing about bikes here (which is about the same as me then) so I had a single speed bike built (it's flat here and I don't need the hassle of gear alignment etc. - keep it simple) It's a light alloy Giant frame with a smattering of tiagra parts and I love it. Trouble is I'm breaking spokes on every ride. The rear wheel is built like a front (ie. non-dished) as is normal here in China and there's no need for extra gear cluster clearance anyway. but I've been told that a dished wheel would cure the problem - I've looked and most info says a dished wheel is slightly less strong but I can't find anything definitive. Is this about torque effect on the drive side - pretty much all my spokes (about 12 so far) have broken on the non-drive side. Any advice before I take it back to the farmers for a proper fix?

WTF?!?
he means you learn all the essentials by doing a 3-cross and the fact most will have a spare wheel to compare.

Ta Dogs got my back!

That's exactly what I meant.

... Trouble is I'm breaking spokes on every ride.

Do your spokes look like this?

No - they're stripey like the ones you get from mcdonalds....

no - seriously though - this is really pissing me off!

@Shanghai: Give us some info...
What are the hubs?
What lacing, 3x, radial, mixed?
Take a picture and post it here, it's easier to help with more info.

If its a cheap hub, maybe the spoke holes have not been chamfered properly and are causing stress points for the spokes. Are the broken spokes those with the head on the outside, inside or both?

ok - I'll take some photos and post later - thanks

sorry about quality of cameraphone pics - should give you an idea of pattern. I don't know the make of rims - they came with some fancy 'steal-me' stickers which I removed. The hub make I've not seen before - but I believe it's reasonable quality. The derailleur is just there for chain tension - and because I didn't want to chuck it if I ever felt the need to put a gear cluster there in the future! I think the bike's pretty cool for 175GBP!

appreciate your comments

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if you can be afford get a 32 spoke 3 cross rear wheel built.

Present spoke count 24?! Are you a heavy rider? no issues with the front?

Thanks for the advice - I am cycling about 50- 75k a week - which is not too heavy - oh...I get your drift! I'm about 85-90kg - that's why I'm trying to get in shape!

..just an update - I broke another spoke on the way to get the wheel fixed - I got the wheel fully rebuilt with new spokes and a straighter dish on the drive side - it cost me less than 5gbp - so if this persists I think i can afford to take your advice - and afford to lose a bit of weight too

.. oh and the front is cool - no problems

Get a new rear wheel with more spokes in. 28 minimum, 32 or 36 even better.

ok, so i'm just getting my head round all this wheel building stuff, am i right in thinking that the dish in the rear wheel comes mostly from the differing length of spoke (drive and non drive side?) Like, you couldn't achieve the dish required with equal length spokes both sides? and how much dish does it create