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@whatfriends
oh also, the frames were the 29" wheel mountain bike frames, the Karate Monkey. one is built as a touring bike with racks and fenders disc brakes and a dynamo front hub, the other is my all weather fixed bike also with fenders and a front disc brake. great frames i reckon, sturdy, not light but i'd be amazed if it didnt last for ever. rugged. and versatile. i alsways wanted a steamroller, bought a fillmore and regretting it. shame. er only cos its the wrong size though. otherwise its grand.