London 2012 Olympics

I say fuck the olympics and fuck the chinese government. Both are shit(s)

yes, so why is this thread titled "Fuck the Olympics"? ;)

You may have a point, I think it would be more correct to call it 'Fuck the Beijing Olympics'

• and then perhaps qualify it a little more in the post by pointing out that it is not the Olympics per say but the actions of the host country that are being protested.
  
  

I was hoping all this would be understood, with 'Fuck the Olympics' being shorthand for all those issues.

But I think you are quite right, I will alter the thread title.

[EDIT:] can't edit the thread title :(

entirely valid point. but the olympics are bigger (and are arguably a better force for positive outcomes) than oranges. sure, there's a bit of corruption involved,

The oranges thing was a bit of a joke ! ;P

And anyway you could have quite rightly pointed out, that by my own logic, I should title a thread against apartheid - 'Fuck oranges !'

. . . so, your point is quite valid.

but on the whole i think that if there is an attempt to make the chinese clean their house through global negative attention focused on them by the olympics... then good.

Agreed.

:D

Coppenger.

Why does that policeman have red bullhorns on his cap?

I think I spoke too soon when I said 'I think most people understand the issues when we say fuck the Olympics.'

No one is complaining about 'scoring' the Olympics.

The demonstrations are about China's appalling human rights violations and in particular the recent crack down on pro-Tibet demonstrators, they have everything to do with Chinese police and military opening fire with automatic rifles into a crowd of Tibetan monks and absolutely nothing to do with London hosting the 2012 games.

Did you think It was odd watching all those Tibetan protesters demonstrating about London hosting the 2012 Olympics ? ;)

Oh yeah, sport has NOTHING at all to do with politics.

What a load of crap. Why did the Chinese want the Olympics? Why did the Eastern Bloc countries have organised doping? Why was Hitler so pissed off when Jesse Owens won everything he entered at the Berlin Olympics? Why did the Mexican government massacre hundreds of protestors in 1968? Why did Black September kidnap and murder Israeli athletes in 1972?

AND

I am complaining about us getting the Olympics, as should every London cyclist who has an interest in cycle sport. Ever heard of Eastway? Not heard that we had 400 ha of purpose built cycle facility taken away, which is going to be replaced with something a quarter the size, and with much less functionality? Know where Hog Hill is?

Jeez, the 2012 Olympics have been an absolute disaster for London cycling so far.

Like badmy and tynan (same guy from cycle chat by any chance?) I will be delighted if the Olympics make a difference to the quality of life in the PRC, but I won't be holding my breath.

+1 Bill
Word to your hamster!

Eastway 5 1/2 miles from the center of town Kog Hill more than 16 at a guess.
Cheers Seb Coe you utter cunt.

Oh yeah, sport has NOTHING at all to do with politics.

What a load of crap. Why did the Chinese want the Olympics? Why did the Eastern Bloc countries have organised doping? Why was Hitler so pissed off when Jesse Owens won everything he entered at the Berlin Olympics? Why did the Mexican government massacre hundreds of protestors in 1968? Why did Black September kidnap and murder Israeli athletes in 1972?

I am not sure what the point is you are making here, it seems to be a rant against what I have said (?) I have not said sport has nothing to with politics.

Of course, with the Olympics, politics and sport are intertwined.

I am simply saying that the people protesting today are not protesting about sport, they are protesting about China's human rights violations.

AND

I am complaining about us getting the Olympics, as should every London cyclist who has an interest in cycle sport. Ever heard of Eastway? Not heard that we had 400 ha of purpose built cycle facility taken away, which is going to be replaced with something a quarter the size, and with much less functionality? Know where Hog Hill is?

Jeez, the 2012 Olympics have been an absolute disaster for London cycling so far.

I agree that this is also an issue, but I was simply pointing out that the protesters today were more engaged in raising awareness of the Chinese government's brutal and violent actions against it's own people and were less concerned about London's cycle paths, to that effect the issues are separate.

Like badmy and tynan (same guy from cycle chat by any chance?) I will be delighted if the Olympics make a difference to the quality of life in the PRC, but I won't be holding my breath.

I too can't see the Olympics making any difference in China.

No - I don't post on cycle chat, that's not me.

That's not my son, Tynan, posting on there either.

A lot of people in E9/E15 have been disenfranchised by the Olympics already - all too predictably.

When I saw all the pathetic rah-rah-rahing going on when the successful bid was announced, it was one of those moments when I felt completely alienated from my own nationality. Not to the extent of the mass headless chicken mourning after a particular car accident in France, but even so, I got that Rosemary's Baby/Invasion Of The Bodysnatchers/They Live/etc paranoia something chronic.

Embrace that alienation bmmf.. it's working for me. Oh wait, mine's more "total ignorance" but you get the idea :)

I am simply saying that the people protesting today are not protesting about sport, they are protesting about China's human rights violations.

I agree that this is also an issue, but I was simply pointing out that the protesters today were more engaged in raising awareness of the Chinese government's brutal and violent actions against it's own people and were less concerned about London's cycle paths, to that effect the issues are separate.

It wasn't a counter argument to yours, more to the general 'keep politics out of sport' line one hears so often.

BTW, we didn't lose some cycle paths - we lost the best cycle sport facility in the South East when Eastway went.

why can't this thread be called 'fuck olympics', with photographs and downloadable videos?

has montreal finished paying for their olympic games yet? i hope that doesn't happen to london.

why can't this thread be called 'fuck olympics', with photographs and downloadable videos?

has montreal finished paying for their olympic games yet? i hope that doesn't happen to london.

See post #10. The answer is yes. In 2006. 30 years later. One of the reasons I was opposed to Toronto's bid for the 2008 (that, and there are much more important things to spend that type of cash on).

tibet is so 90's (and not in a reto-cool way) its all about dafure (sp?) now, cant the lefties get with the times?

all i can say is YES!, this is possibly one of the best pchops on the fourm.

dafure (sp?)

That's a first!

yeah i have no idea how to spell that so i went phonetic on its arse

I liked the comical use of a fire extinguisher, looked like an 80's Top of the Pops appearance with the dry ice in effect

;]

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http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7333955.stm
now the french are having the same issues.

sport can be a political tool, yes, but the long sporting boycott of south africa accomplished nothing to end apartheid - the world just moved on and the old hardline nationalist men (Botha and his cronies) died or moved out of power (combined with sustained trade restrictions and political pressure). nor did the boycott of the moscow olympics affect soviet policy in afghanistan - they pulled out when it got too expensive. i think change in tibet is likely to follow a similar course, china is gradually loosening up anyway and getting more liberalised, and protesting against the olympics being held in beijing is basically useless. raising awareness and increasing political pressure on the chinese government over a sustained period will be far more effective.

unfortunately most western economies are far too dependent on chinese-produced goods (and in some cases, like Australia, on china buying raw materials) to really put pressure on them in a trade boycott sense.

to make this relevant, there are lots of bicycles in china (not sure if they're fixed though).

"fuck the protesters who are using the olympics to grandstand their own political causes"

Why fuck the protesters? Its one of the most highly viewed and reported events in the world, not just sporting.

I cant think of a better platform for protest.

to make this relevant, there are lots of bicycles in china (not sure if they're fixed though).

'Lots' is too much of an open estimation, for the real scientific data you need to listen to Katie Melua's pop smash "Nine Million Bicycles":

"There are nine million bicycles in Beijing
That's a fact
It's a thing we can't deny"

sport can be a political tool, yes, but the long sporting boycott of south africa accomplished nothing to end apartheid - the world just moved on and the old hardline nationalist men (Botha and his cronies) died or moved out of power (combined with sustained trade restrictions and political pressure). nor did the boycott of the moscow olympics affect soviet policy in afghanistan - they pulled out when it got too expensive. i think change in tibet is likely to follow a similar course, china is gradually loosening up anyway and getting more liberalised, and protesting against the olympics being held in beijing is basically useless. raising awareness and increasing political pressure on the chinese government over a sustained period will be far more effective.

unfortunately most western economies are far too dependent on chinese-produced goods (and in some cases, like Australia, on china buying raw materials) to really put pressure on them in a trade boycott sense.

to make this relevant, there are lots of bicycles in china (not sure if they're fixed though).

well said.

thing is, it's very obvious why the protestors didn't choose another time to start a fire. they could obviously have done it any other time before.

i'd like to add that i think most people are actually rather ill-informed of the whole issue due to the way it is portrayed in the media. to be honest, anyone who thinks that this is a protest about china's human right's records doesn't know half of the story. tibet independence is a very complicated issue - the population consists of at 3 major ethnic groups and that means it could well end up like what was known as yugoslavia if the original tibetans simply declare independence. also, whatever is happening there at the moment - the riots, the suppression, equates to nothing apart from suffering at the level of the common citizen (both protestors on the street level and the army that was sent there). the chinese government was blamed for suppressing without negotiating - but was there any chance for them to negotiate? that's exactly what the minds behind the protests are obviously aiming for - they wouldn't open up their doors for any form of negotiation. in fact the suppression is pretty much your standard issue riot suppression policy of any other government on the planet (well, done the chinese way). there isn't a clean, easy solution to this. all this is obviously done to garner western media attention at this very time. the dalai lama has also been rather quiet about the whole thing. he's a great great spiritual leader, but also a politician all the same, and he knows how to play his cards.

yes, i'm chinese, but i'm not taking sides on this issue. i just think i'd like to voice my opinion as it seems that everyone is summing up the thing as 'chinese government violence'. the fact is there are injured soldiers and burning army vehicles you weren't shown.

bicycle numbers in beijing are dropping. as they get more affluent they prefer cars - it's a status symbol. it's getting like america now, get in the car for a journey you could have done in 3minutes walking, or even worse, just driving around in a car for the sake of driving it. vanity.

Why fuck the protesters? Its one of the most highly viewed and reported events in the world, not just sporting.

I cant think of a better platform for protest.

please don't selectively quote me out of context. if you read the whole post, you'll see the other options i suggested (first) were the exact opposite point of view. i just suggested opposing points of view because i didn't want to put a particular political point of view in Tynan's mouth (i have/had no idea what his personal politics are).

i think it's pretty clear that i wasn't actually saying "fuck the protesters", although i do think they could claim more moral high ground if they weren't quite so extreme. getting violent just makes them look like a bunch of loonies and legitimises the OTT chinese security presence.

tibet independence is a very complicated issue

Tibet independence.

Was this issue made more or less complicated by the chinese invasion and annexation?