Help a guy out...

On the one hand, smashing stuff is bad, mmkay.

On the other, it's a Merc, so fuck it.

good logic...

Not 1 single word about poor old Joe Strummer and the BLATANT rip-off of his iconic imagery. He's enraged I hear.

An enraged corpse?

It's the night of the living dead, I tell you!

kipsy Not 1 single word about poor old Joe Strummer and the BLATANT rip-off of his iconic imagery. He's enraged I hear.

A pedant writes:

If you mean the cover of London Calling that was Paul Simenon whacking the stage with his bass, not Joe.

.....but you got my drift though. I shoulda googled first!

.

So this motorist's windscreen was broken as a result of a collision at lights in which the other vehicle was damaged? Sounds about right to me.

the point is..

there is currently a clash of cultures in the streets of london brought about my the massive increase in cyclists over the last few years. This clash is principally derived from conflicting views of ownership over the said streets.

In the last 40 years there has been an attitude of segregating all modes of transport, both by users and the authorities. This has bread a culture where each mode believes they have their own space and any overlap is interference.

Alas, this attitude is now changing, in theory at least. Starting with the authorities and (hopefully) seeping down to the users.

In practice, some particular users don't see things this way, they still think that each mode should be in their own space. Pedestrians on pavements, cyclists on cycle lanes and cars on roads - and this is what needs changed.

The point is that the clash of cultures has to become explicit to the extent that the authorities take notice and campaign to change the attitude towards ownership over streets to how things used to be - - Victorian streets never had pavements, they were for everyone.

So i think yes, people should buy these t-shirts and they should get pissed of with drivers....when there is something wrong tolerance won't make it right.

......on the other hand i guess everyone is just trying to get home.

It's Pennie Smith they robbed the image from, Paul just did the smashing..

silver So i think yes, people should buy these t-shirts and they should get pissed of with drivers....when there is something wrong tolerance won't make it right.

so with this logic you just made up we as cyclist are aloud to get pissed off with drivers...which means drivers are aloud to get pissed off with cyclist....when drivers get pissed off with cyclists they crash into them and when cylist get pissed off with drivers they throw there bike through the drivers windscreen...
wow ever thought of getting into politics?

aidan [quote]silver So i think yes, people should buy these t-shirts and they should get pissed of with drivers....when there is something wrong tolerance won't make it right.

so with this logic you just made up we as cyclist are aloud to get pissed off with drivers...which means drivers are aloud to get pissed off with cyclist....when drivers get pissed off with cyclists they crash into them and when cylist get pissed off with drivers they throw there bike through the drivers windscreen...
wow ever thought of getting into politics?[/quote]

i'm hoping things won't go that far - but the problem has to be identified then solved. And the solution has to be that everyone can co-exist on the streets without fear for their lives or having to cower inside ultra-segregated bike lanes protected on all sides by shatter-proof persplex....or somehting like that.

it works both ways...

No it doesn't. Let's say I ride considerately, taking car not to cut up any cars, etc.
Some cnut will still knock me over or get angry and take issue just for me being there. Fsck 'em.
Treat me nice and I will treat you nice, try and run me over and I'll consider adding GT stripes to your paint job.. and I don't mean the racing kind.

silver So i think yes, people should buy these t-shirts and they should get pissed of with drivers....when there is something wrong tolerance won't make it right.

Hallelulea! - Can I get a "Hell Yeah!"

no

hippy No it doesn't. Let's say I ride considerately, taking car not to cut up any cars, etc.
Some cnut will still knock me over or get angry and take issue just for me being there. Fsck 'em.
Treat me nice and I will treat you nice, try and run me over and I'll consider adding GT stripes to your paint job.. and I don't mean the racing kind.

And another "Hell Yeah!"

20 years of fucking polite cycling has seen me actually clear a car (rear to front) in Wood Green, has seen me with broken thumb and chipped bone in my foot (still there, still loose) - has seen me winded on the floor in the West end with road rash more than half a dozen times - in bed with a badly swollen thigh - in hospital with a fractured rib and minor pneumothorax and numerous other minor injuries.

Fuck all that, people don't learn from me staying invisible, especially when they have knowingly risked taking my life to reduce their traveling time by a few seconds.

What I have learnt is to ride much more aggressively, much more confrontationally, I do not ride in the gutter, getting out of the way of every car who cannot wait to speed up to the red lights 100 yards ahead, I stand my ground and if threatened I will react in the way nature intended, not with deference to some arbitrary law or set of road ethics, but by showing the driver that it is not acceptable to risk injuring a fellow human.

I believe (and of course cannot say for sure) that this has made me safer (perhaps experience plays its part).

I would rather throw my bike in front of a car to stop it moving off after an incident and tell the driver exactly what I feel about him or her nearly taking my life - rather than curtail my natural instincts and drag both the driver and myself through months of officialdom to arrive at pretty much the same place.

i agree with what your saying,i also ride aggressively and tend to alert most drivers of my presence. i don't have a problem with the way some cyclist act but i do have a problem with the image they are setting for London cyclist in general.

"if threatened I will react in the way nature intended".....do you do everything as nature intended?

as much as id love to damage the cars these cuntly drivers drive, my head always go forward to possible costly and lengthy legal ramble that could ensue...so no, i will never ever try to damage their cars. that said, i wont run if the fckr jumps out of his car...im up for a punch-up. ive been workin out ;-)

how are bicycles classified here in terms of road rules? in oz (or is that just vic?) they're seen as vehicles which sorts of protects us cos that means we have as much right to be on the road as any other mobile metal box. of course this doesnt mean cyclists there are safe. cars rule there...no arguments. this is where the issue of 'rights to be on road' comes in...are we part of road or do road rules not apply to us? jump lights 'cos you're not a vehicle' then maybe you're not...then get off the fkn road! am i being clear? anyway loads of legal issues there...once upon a time i was a traffic engineer (council) constantly liaising with vicroads re cycle lanes/routes

in terms of the tshirt and fundraising. good design. also agree that it sends the wrong message...id get it, but ill only wear it in oz ...to piss em car worshipers there ;-). what i dont get is the guy did it, regrets it and yet he's all for promoting this tee design (or maybe he didnt have a say)? is he sorry for his actions or is he sorry for getting deported? on the other hand are we getting overly sensitive about it all...loads of more offensive tee prints out there. deportation is way way unfair tho...what kind of a ruling is that?! asbo kids gets away with a lot worse

sht, im full of contradictions...hypocrita!

i chuck arrospok at merc. peace

aidan "if threatened I will react in the way nature intended".....do you do everything as nature intended?

Hmmm . . this really is one of those trivial semantic devices employed to feature where decent argument fails. :(

Do you really want me to answer or is there a point you feel you are making here, if so it is not clear (to me at least).

you know what...fuck it....now where can i get one of those shirts?

aidan you know what...fuck it....now where can i get one of those shirts?

I knew you'd come around to my way of thinking ! :)

Can I get a "Hell Yeah?!" ;-)

Heavens No

Cars never had to share the rd, with anyone else apart from other cars, for the most part up until 10 years or so ago. When they had to share the rd with other cars it pissed them off, they got mad and shouted and honked at each other, but for the most part, (most part) didnt get out and tap on each others windows. Lots of cyclists ride on the rd now and cars have to share the rd, with more people/traffic/bodies/numbers it makes them more pissed off. I'm sure most don't realise they are driving a lethal weapon, until they ride a bike. (how many people do you know who ask: "ooh how can you ride a bike in london? isnt it scary?" I bet they aren't scared in their cars.)