Home DIY

Thank you! I have never worked with a junction box or a transformer (and currently wouldn't be able to identify them if I was looking at them, though I could of course look it up) - is there a reason why changing out with an integrated downlight would be preferable to a simpler swap of bulbs with one of these? Not sure how much access to the transformer/junction box I'd have through the 10cm hole in my ceiling.

Just replaced 10 of them this afternoon, stuck in the adjustable version of this - really easy to do

I watched this video, was really easy I was replacing integrated units that had failed and was a straight swap https://youtu.be/VzV-81rNjM4?si=6sPuCV6JNW8FVzA0

Issue is I don't currently have an integrated LED unit though; I've got a halogen light bulb stuck in a small round plastic fitting connected to a smallish black box which should come apart but it's got electrical tape on.. and that's about all that comes out of the ceiling hole. Presumably the black box is the junction box but I don't know where the transformer would be?

Ah ok, can just stick a led bulb in there then, prob Gu10 - if you cant get the other one open they are really easy to swap out

Without pictures, its difficult to know what it is. It could be a junction box, or just the chocolate box that is part of the light fitting.

They're MR11 aren't they, not GU10?

If I can do it, anyone can, I reckon.

Just pulled out the down light fitting and it appears to be pretty much the same thing as the other light but in a spring rather than screw-in enclosure (thanks @Spooky_head for the video!); this one doesn’t say MR11 on the bulb it but also appears to be a GU4 fitting? Are there any downsides to just pulling out the halogen bulb and plugging in an LED one? Seems overkill to rewire if I don’t have to (though not averse to it if preferable of course).

Also, how do I avoid damaging the plaster in the ceiling if I’m pulling the spring fitting out - the spring arm catches on the edge and I’ve not got enough leverage at the pivot until I pull it slightly out..

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Another lighting question -

I want to install a new pendent ceiling light to replace an already installed pendent and I’m trying to work out of its a DIY job or try to find someone to do it.

The photo is what I see when I unscrew the plastic cover on the current pendent. The instructions on the new light say that no Earth must be attached and it has a junction box with just Live and Neutral terminals. So is it a case of removing this entire assembly, wiring the Live and Neutrals to the other end of the junction box and then what with the Earth?

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Are there any downsides to just pulling out the halogen bulb and plugging in an LED one?

A lot of transformers have simple circuitry that only works properly with the full load of a real halogen bulb. With LEDs they can either not work at all or flicker or flash. Only one way to find out.

Also, how do I avoid damaging the plaster in the ceiling if I’m pulling the spring fitting out - the spring arm catches on the edge and I’ve not got enough leverage at the pivot until I pull it slightly out..

Damage is largely inevitable and annoying, but these exist:

c-fix.

You have (I think) three cables coming in there, one for the supply coming in, one taking the supply to the next light in the house and one going off to the switch (and back). This is standard in the UK but not done in many other countries, and your instructions are written assuming the latter - i.e. that all of this complexity happens somewhere else and you only have simple connections for the light in the ceiling.

You need to recreate all of those connections if you want the switch and the other lights in the house to work. So your options are either to wedge some extra connectors in the base of the other light, or reuse this base.

It has a junction box with just Live and Neutral terminals

Seems a bit weird, you’ll generally need a loop in section to wire the switch into the live, unless it’s expecting this to be done before it gets to the light?

You got a picture?

There generally isn’t an earth on the actual light cable (if it’s a plastic fixture), but the others in the ring/switch lines definitely need to be earthed

@grams @slippers

Thanks both. Here’s a pic of the new light’s junction box. I can’t imagine I’ll be able to fit everything in the new cover as it also needs to hold the bracket to attach the pendent to the ceiling.

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Yeah, looks like you’ll need to have all the switch gubbins either in a junction box in the cavity if you can access that, or you could maybe shove some wago-style connectors in there to replicate a standard ceiling rose set up.

This is what you’d need to replicate basically. Should be easy enough to do it yourself if there’s space/access!

(Edit: bad image, this one's better)

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I recently replaced a ceiling rose with similar birds nest of cables with a simple led one. I continued the circuits with wagos and shoved the lot up into the ceiling.

You can get ones where the centre part unscrews meaning you can replace the bulbs without taking the whole lot out.

The thing is that I can't seem to find the transformer - the only thing that comes out of the socket is the bulb connected to the white fitting connected to that black plastic box which is in turn connected to two white wires that go off into the ceiling like you can see in the second photo.

Appreciate it, thank you

No worries! I just replaced one a couple of days ago and was similarly scratching my head about which wires were going where and why. Didn’t help that there were two things spurred off it, with bare live cables dangling out of a cupboard.

It's possible that it's hidden away somewhere else. They're 12v bulbs, so they need a transformer somewhere.

Unless your house is actually a boat, of course.

Are they any other removable items/panels/etc in your ceiling? In my bathroom you can only get at the connections by taking down the ceiling extractor fan.

Yeah there’s an extractor fan as well. Also had a poke around the hole and this plastic thing may be it? Although it’s slightly resisting being budged at the moment and I don’t want to force it if I don’t know what it is.

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That's what's known as 3 plate wiring (or loop in), see https://www.diynot.com/wiki/Electrics:Lighting-Circuit-layouts . If you want to convert to a class 2 light fixture (i.e. double insulated so no earth required) which doesn't use the traditional ceiling rose then I think the easiest and safest option for a DIY-er is to use a Quickwire junction box (https://www.quickwire.co.uk/product/switch-load-16a/) to move all the connections up into the ceiling void and then just run a bit of twin and earth down into the new light fixture (obviously the earth core will be left unused). The Quickwire is much more expensive than a choc box or equivalent but it's a doddle to use and provides a maintenance free connection which is technically possibly required in this application. This is what I did when swapping our ceiling light fixtures. However, obviously if you're not confident/comfortable working with mains electrics then get a pro in.

Edit: exactly this: https://youtube.com/shorts/n36nVG8l8RE?si=JjeaMtZETe6YBGFf