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Given it’s your first place, do you really want to have to move in and potentially immediately have to do some big works when you’ll have very little cash reserves to do them properly? Asides from the money side, that’s likely to be quite stressful.
When we moved into our place we had to replace the roof (we knew about this and got roofers to quote to knock money off) and then redo several rooms which unexpectedly and almost immediately started pissing water evertywhere. Good now, but could really have done without the stress or financial strain as there were other things we’d have liked to fix first. Looking back, less work when we were trying to figure things out would have been a nicer experience.
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A second opinion on the roof from a roofer could be a wise move. My impression is a lot of surveyors seem to be overly negative about the state of the roof. I got 5 years out of mine that needed to be replaced immediately.
A fairly large sized zig zagging crack in the rear wall under the bedroom window. There is no lintel above the downstairs door and window which is below the crack, just brick.
This sounds like one that you're going to have to think about how much you want the place and how much you're willing to spend whilst possibly having to walk away. What's your relationship with the agent like, how likely is the agent going to be to convince them that they're going to potentially have to take a hit on this.
Offering "asking price" in itself doesn't mean much. How does the price compare to similar properties, does it reflect that work needs doing or is it priced top end?
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Interesting.
I feel the outcome will be determined by how keen the sellers are to move.
If they have a place lined up already, and have had some buyers pull out, they will negotiate and you will be able to chip them a fair amount.
If you are the first buyers and they feel they can afford the wait, they will push as hard as they like and try and test you.
I would, personally, get in touch with the seller. Try and strike up a dialog. Going through the EA won't really work here. Also, I'd start looking for another place, a plan B, as you might need it.
FWIW, any roof over 20 years old would be classed as end of life, so don't read too much in to that on it's own. We had a similar report for ours, OG unlined Edwardian tiled roof. It's still going after a £7k service. If the wooden roof structure is fucked somehow, that's another story. So I'd be keen to find out the real condition of the structure underneath. That's a Roofer's job, but as always, it will be hard to get them in to look without the possibility of a job lined up.
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I'd be walking away from that one.
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Amend your offer to what you think I fair given you have to find money for work (also condition may affect your ability to get a mortgage if you get a bad day where they actually check something)
Be willing to walk away if they don't budge significantly.
It sounds like a metricfucktonne of work to me
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We also can't negotiate. We don't have any more money.
From what you've said, there's no way you're getting the full cost of works knocked off by the sellers. Given building work will always cost double what you expect, and you've offered all the money you have, this seems like a simple equation unfortunately
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Long post
Maybe the hivemind could provide some advice.
Me and my partner are first time buyers, offer accepted on a house. It was fresh on the market and we offered full asking price as we are very keen on it, didn't want to be outbid and just wanted to make it all quick and easy.
It's a 100 year old house. We knew full well there would be some moisture, plenty of routine maintenance. I am happy to have a go at a lot myself, all no worries.
We had a survey done anyway which showed up lots of what we expected: moisture readings in the walls, bits of repointing needed and some pointing that has been repaired with cement mortar that has cracked and needs redoing. All fine.
It also however pulled up some more serious issues, primarily with the roof:
1) Several broken, slipped, missing or loose tiles. They're the original slate tiles.
2) Lots of tiles fixed with tingles. Potentially inidicating original nails/fixtures are at end of life and failing regularly now.
3) Roof is unlined. Not a problem but given the above, water is getting in.
4) There is rot in the roof timbers due to the above and also insufficient insulation in the attic.
5) There is evidence of both woodworm and wood boring beetle in the roof timber. Not sure if current or historic infestiation.
4) Chimney stack mortar has failed in several places, the pots are uncapped despite the fireplaces being closed within the house. There is water staining on the walls of the chimney breasts within the house due to this.
5) The flashing around the chimney stack is cement and has cracked/failed in multiple places.
6) A fairly large sized zig zagging crack in the rear wall under the bedroom window. There is no lintel above the downstairs door and window which is below the crack, just brick. The owners admit the crack got worse when they had the windows replaced/double glazed. Potentially a not insignificant structural issue here requiring a steel put in. As it is, the weight of the upstairs walls could be partially supported by the downstair door and window surround. Those are original single glazed. The rest of the house has been double glazed apart from these two...(do they know the wall is fucked and have left this window and door precisely because they don't want to take on the work?)
Surveyor suggests the roof is end of life. It might last the rest of the winter but it won't do another one. You could keep having someone come out and replace the fallen tiles but eventually the cost will outweigh just having it replaced. Especially considering the timber is not in good shape.
The issues with the chimney stack are where the water is coming in which is causing damp inside the house and in the roof.
The rear wall is a big worry and if it needs structural work, this will be expensive.
We've gone back to the estate agent (our solicitor just said yep, go renegotiate with the agent) and said surveyor says it needs a new roof, the chimney fixed and the rear wall looked at and fixed. We made it clear that there were a lot of other issues flagged which we are not raising since with this age of property, we expect work and are happy to do it.
Agent spoke to me on the phone and said the sellers will be happy to negotiate but they are not going to pay for a new roof "and why should they?" (wtf?).
He says as far as they're concerned, the roof is water tight and if they were not moving, they wouldn't be replacing it so why would they pay for us to replace it.
I understand this opinion, however the surveyor (who I know is likely to tell us worst case scenario) says it needs replacing or at the least recovering with adhoc timber work. I'm inclined to trust the surveyor over the seller who wants rid.
In our opinion, we're not asking them to pay for a new roof. We're saying the house is worth less because it has a buggered roof and rear wall that we didn't know about when offering asking price.
We also can't negotiate. We don't have any more money. We need them to reduce the price by enough to cover the work which I don't consider "maintenance" (It is past that), or we will have to pull out.
So I guess I'm wondering, do we think the seller is right to not have to pay to fix it all, do we think it is worth us paying more for a structural survey on the rear wall knowing they're unlikely to cough up for the work, or when presented with quotes for repairs, might they realise that all buyers are going to want the same thing and agree to pay it?
They've got full asking out of us, they must have been prepared to accept a lower offer when they put it on the market, now they're being tight about it like it's money out of their pocket. They've made 100k on the house in 10 years.
Penny for your thoughts.