Coffee Appreciation

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My Gen 1 Ode is now sadly surplus to requirements. It's ground around 200g a week since purchased new last October (until it was decommissioned in June). Still in amazing condition, with cleaned burrs, packed it in its original box with the little brush - any interest for £120? Pick up from E5 or happy to post.

It can pretty much be transformed into the Gen 2 by switching to Gen 2 burrs (£75) but being V1 it won't take SSP.

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The Philos is very different to the niche zero. Shots taste more effervescent and sweeter. They pull much more evenly in terms of flow rate, the Niche shots start slow and then accelerate, so I assume there is channelling happening in the Niche grounds later in the shot.

Philos is a little more fussy about puck prep, am finding when I use the WDT tool it’s best if I create a little mound in the centre of the portage before I use the distribution tool and then tamp. If I am not so fastidious there is often a little bit of side ways spray (am using a naked portafilter).

I am enjoying the change, the knocker device to get coffee out is useful, but I can’t be arsed with the chute dildo.

Talk to me about the static/retention that big Hoff moans about

So long as I gave the beans a bit of RDT action, I didn't have any meaningful issues. The only minor thing I found was that you might have to help the last few beans into the grinder as the RDT can cause them to stick slightly to the hopper sides.

It's much quieter, faster and less prone to mess than the DF54 that's replaced it. But it can't do espresso.

How annoying is the beep that big Hoff talks about? I'm used to RDT with the Wilfa and the subsequent sticky beans. I always have to use a little brush to brush the last of the beans in. Ok count me interested, I'll DM.

I read stuff like this and wonder if I just don't have a particularly sensitive palate (and/or whether upgrading any of my kit would ever be worth). I honestly don't think I would notice more 'effervescence' in a shot, but don't know if I'm kidding myself (out of spending money i don't have on chasing 'x')?

Is this a me thing? Or are some people naturally able/better at distinguishing the flavour profiles for burr set 'x' to 'y'?

Note - not knocking this poster at all. Just using them as an interesting foil to my taste range, which seems to go as far as sweet/sour/bitter/fruity/woody etc (basic B coffee tasting?!)

Bellows baby. 3D printed bellows solve most retention problems.

Honestly, I can't say it bothered me. It beeps when you turn it on, when you press start and when it's finished. So realistically, that's 3 beeps, not a big deal and made up for by the fact that it turns itself off when done, so you don't have to. DMing now.

Damn this is speaking to me... do I just need to replace the whole setup now!

When you can compare the grinders back to back it is easier. It’s also nice to switch things up just so taste buds don’t get bored. I like tinkering with bread recipes, food prep etc as it changes the end product. If you slice, chop, crush or mince garlic the flavour profile changes and clearly different ways of smashing coffee beans have a discernible impact.

We tend to order different coffees as by the end of a bag of beans our palates feel like a change.

I am not someone who is articulate on all the flavonoids in coffee but I do know I prefer some beans to others. And annoyingly most of the time when my wife and I blind taste test beans we always prefer the more expensive ones.

I guess this is the crux of my question - am I missing out on enjoying the absolute best coffee because I don't have the 'best'/most expensive setup, or am I simply being envious and in reality we're all just chasing diminishing returns?

Simply put - how many people could really tell the difference between a shot pulled on my Classic versus a Decent?

No, it’s like playing good music, if the music’s good you’ll enjoy it on a crappy radio. It will be better on a posh hifi, and the fact that you’ve bought the posh hifi will make you pay closer attention to it, but it’s the raw material that’s bringing 95% of the joy.

Totally agree it’s diminishing returns/ marginal gains. Good music is good music but there can be an enhanced experience on a better hi-fi

But this is how my friends sort out a hi-fi dj setup for a festival.

https://www.facebook.com/share/v/9fLNmYZCGU4J44x3/?mibextid=KsPBc6

That looks great, I’d have a V60 from him.

I do like the hi-fi simile, I’m on both sides of it. I roll my eyes at a lot of the kit talk on here just because I have a continuous stream of broken coffee kit to mend and the only thing I get excited about is user-friendliness and durability. There’s not really anything ‘bad’ in terms of cup quality out there as long as you’re putting good coffee through it.

That being said I still covet kit that my own experience tells me won’t produce a noticeable improvement after a brief honeymoon period when it comes to music so I get it. I also roll my eyes at old audio grumpies on forums who tell people new kit is a waste of money and all this stuff was perfected decades ago.

It was crazy, the power cables were over a grand per device, the DAC and clocks for the cdjs were about £20K per cd player. But it sounded magnificent.

I kept the sound engineer caffeinated with YBCR batch brews all weekend.

Yeah! That’s the way.

The tent was run and managed by Adam from Trojan Sound and Colleen Cosmo Murphy of Classic Album Sundays and The Loft so the audio was going to be on point, when she played the Koetsu cartridges were on the turntables.

They are also YBCR customers.

and the fact that you’ve bought the posh hifi will make you believe it sounds better.

What's the coffee equivalent of 10 grand phono cables?

I also roll my eyes at old audio grumpies on forums who tell people new kit is a waste of money and all this stuff was perfected decades ago.

I appreciate this is going way off topic but if you ever have a chance to try a John Linsley Hood class A transistor amplifier or a Mullard 3-3 class A valve amp with good transformers (please do) you’ll almost certainly change your viewpoint on that! However, and I know this is a really big however, without building your own, you’re unlikely to ever find one to find out. It’s the reason I built both of mine with period-correct carefully matched vintage components and, wow, they’re so very detailed and pure!

Swiss lever machine

I'm with Steve on this topic.

I have an ECM espresso machine and I also regularly drink Aeropress and french press. I have a couple of decent grinders. Good beans in - good coffee out. Generally I buy YBCR and Square Mile. There are other coffees out there but I'm not in a rush to spend £20+ on a bag of beans.

Likewise hifi. I think decent amps make a difference, I like Meridian from the '90s, nicely engineered products. I like Spendor speakers among others. Equally I can enjoy music with an £80 pair of Bluetooth headphones.

I have an old pair of Linn speakers in the kitchen. They are flawed, but drop a great track and everyone smiles and moves. That's what I love.

None of this is last word on anything. £10k cables are ridiculous imo but if people want to try them, that's fine too.

I had got the cost of the power cables a little bit wrong

I’ve seen at least an extra zero on top of that with frequency and voltage conversion for power isolation. The HiFi world pales the coffee world into insignificance! That’s before you get into tube rolling and that’s before you get into 6-figure bespoke triodes! Plus the rest. It’s a mad world.

I don’t understand stuff like this at all - because surely it’s the actual power source and how clean the earth itself is that’ll matter. Rather than what happens between socket and connection point?

I put quite a premium on service life and serviceability these days- the coffee machine I have should, hopefully, last for the next 40 years, and I hope the grinder does as well.

With the Niche grinders I’m assuming it’s a “send it back” if something goes wrong, whereas Marzocco and Mazzer have local service people who come out and fix on site.

Of course I also hope that the combination makes great coffee, but I suspect that’s more on me than on the machines.