In the news

Omg this sounds good. German paper mountains are so bad, maybe down under is an option after all?

Tell me about it. Two years later and I am still having to deal with my Dad's estate after his passing. Try selling property when you're not in the country... Headf*CK.

Or Fujitsu......

Interested to know why people here are against them.

Given how much of our data is shared I'm less concerned than when I was younger and I see the advantages.

Being honest, I think I'm largely a product of parents who lived in Continental Europe in the late 6os, mainly France. So the stories about heavy handed CRS doing ID stops and the threat of jail for not having an ID (or being from anywhere south of France) stay with me. I guess I associate them with authoritarianism and they don't quite smell British.

When we've been in France and say I nip to the bakery without an ID they still get really anxious.

So I think the real question is; assuming we adopt ID cards, what happens if you aren't carrying it?

Greek friend of mine always left hers at home- the penalty for losing it was worse than not having it on her.

When we've been in France and say I nip to the bakery without an ID they still get really anxious.

At least the new ones are the size of a credit card and not the stupid things that needed a wallet the size of an A4 binder to carry them about.

I never carry my Spanish residency/ID anywhere. The ball ache to replace it is not worth it. I just have a photo.

So I think the real question is; assuming we adopt ID cards

How about we just do not

Same here; UK and French passport at home, ID at home, driving license in wallet which is fine for day to day use.

I'm Portuguese and I've carried my ID card every day for my entire life, it's just a card in my wallet. Never gave it a second thought.

I think a lot of the data and privacy concerns with regards to ID cards don't really hold the weight they used to given how much data we willing give over to any corporation that asks for it and the UK already being the most heavily video survailed country in Europe. The question of whether or not you'd have to have it on you at all times and who gets to demand to see it is a concern though.

Above all for me though is the unbelievable cost of rolling out a country wide ID card system from scratch and what need is it fulfilling that isn't already covered by other things such as passports and driving licenses etc.

Honestly surprised that the far right fasch parties haven't been championing them as a way to know who the illegals are. (or maybe they have?)

Was/is the Portuguese ID a policy of the Salazar dictatorship?

Give me an ID card. It's a fucking joke that in the 21st century all of these government bodies need their own independent set of records:

• DVLA V5C
  
• DVLA direct debit
  
• Driving licence
  
• GP
  
• Dentist
  
• Electoral register
  
• Student loans
  
• Council tax
  
• HMRC
  
  

Just put it on one fucking website and give me an official document that I can use to prove to the bank who I am and where I live

not at all, way way earlier. I always find it weird how countries that don't have them associate them to something authoritative. It's just a card to ID yourself when dealing with government services (or buying alcohol or entering bars or whatever)
I don't even know how it could be used for anything bad to be honest

what need is it fulfilling that isn't already covered by other things such as passports and driving licenses etc.

I guess part of that is that many people don't have those? Don't know about driving licences, but I had a quick look at the data for held passports across the UK and the ratio of British passport:no passport was around 5:1 or so.

Honestly surprised that the far right fasch parties haven't been championing them as a way to know who the illegals are. (or maybe they have?)

Have you seen how those people react to the idea of '15 minute cities'? You think they'd be up for a compulsory ID card system?

Just put it on one fucking website and give me an official document that I can use to prove to the bank who I am and where I live

then you end up with some really odd shit... I needed a new driving license as mine expired. No drama, get an appointment so they can take a photo (saves a few euros but can be done by post too). They also needed a copy of a proof of address and a police check. All of these are free, can be got from the SAME government app and take about 30 seconds to get. However, they don't do this, they make me download the docs from my app, print them and bring them (or email them when i'm at the appointment if I want). I asked why they don't do it automatically and supposedly it's a GDPR/data protection thing

Then there's the dumb French process where they accept a digital proof of address but print it, scan it then shred it.

I think a lot of the data and privacy concerns with regards to ID cards don't really hold the weight they used to given how much data we willing give over to any corporation that asks for it and the UK already being the most heavily video survailed country in Europe. The question of whether or not you'd have to have it on you at all times and who gets to demand to see it is a concern though.

So - because we're already over-surveiled, we should be fine with more?

I don't trust this, or any future government*(or parliament) to implement something like this without including any number of illiberal elements, either by design, incompetence or sefl-serving malice, that will fuck over the already marginalised and disenfranchised.

* or any past government

Fucking hell Rotherham

This

I did add an etc in there (also birth certificates) , I was just making the point that we don't need a compulsory ID to get access to anything we can't get access to with all the other forms we have now.

Have you seen how those people react to the idea of '15 minute cities'? You think they'd be up for a compulsory ID card system?

I'm not looking for consistency with fasch arguments and I always expect their hatred for forruns to trump everything.

So - because we're already over-surveiled, we should be fine with more?

No, but I think a lot of the who has the database arguments are just not relevant anymore. I'd rather an accountable government have the information than companies like Google and meta.

Admittedly it’s difficult but giving away your info to private companies is optional and controls exist to allow you to be forgotten.

but giving away your info to private companies is optional.

In theory yeah but let's be honest it's almost impossible to buy anything or do anything online without giving away swathes of data.

controls exist to allow you to be forgotten.

I think you are missing the point but you continue to do you