Electronic & Hydraulic Shifting (Di2, Ui2, customisations)

Where does it end? 15 cogs? 20?!

Someone has found Shimano patents

Shimano (and SRAM) file a lot of patents, frequently of dubious merit, not with the intention of using the IP in their own products but to place road blocks in the way of competitors. It's entry level patent trolling. In some jurisdictions and some eras, you actually had to bring a product to market within typically three years in order to benefit from the ten to twenty year exclusivity protected by the patent office. Maybe we should bring that back.

Many of these patents should not be allowed, they are to broad an idea to be uniquely innovative. SRAM having the same battery for front and rear derailleur is an example. That’s ridiculous.

these patents should not be allowed, they are to broad an idea to be uniquely innovative

Inspection at patent offices seems to be weak to non-existent, which helps the trolls. The mere fact of a patent having been applied for is often sufficient to discourage new market entrants, because even if it's fairly obviously without merit, you still have to spend a pile of money on lawyers to challenge it either before designing your own product or after the incumbent player launches vexatious litigation when you come to market.

The patent system is totally broken, full of scumbags taking the piss. Patents have been awarded to biotech firms for discovering genes.

Patent, copyright, capitalism, can get in the sea.

The problem is that most people (including the patent office) can't follow and understand the technical aspects of an proposal anymore so stuff gets awarded and they leave it to the courts if someone decides to challenge it.

Does anyone have a PCE1 that I could use to check/update a SM-BMR1 that isn't showing up on e-tube using the normal charger? Beer can be supplied...

Seem to read that I need PCE1 rather than a PCE02, but shout if you know otherwise.

Shifter question...

My right hand Ultegra r8070 shifter is probably dead, according to my LBS. Won't bleed. I suddenly lost braking power on both brakes a couple of weeks ago. Right hand brake has always been a bit dodgy, a little bit of travel in the lever before anything happens but it's something I am used to and most of the time doesn't affect the braking. About once a year or every two years I experience total brake loss in that brake and normally a bleed solves it but this time it doesn't want to know. My LBS are planning to strip the shifter to investigate but the mechanic says this is a crappy job he doesn't really want to do. I'm happy to pay for it. Anyway...

In the event this shifter is fucked, what are my options for other repair or replacement? I can't find a right hand r8070 shifter available anywhere. Do I really have to buy a set? Even second hand they are really spendy aren't they. Honestly I would rather the frameset fail than a shifter. Bike was bought in 2019 so well out of warranty.

It would be fucking weird but what about one Ultegra and one GRX shifter?

Is it on a bike with full internal hoses?

If not, I'd consider going to cable brakes with some hybrid calipers (because plain cable disc calipers are a pain in the arse with the constant adjustment). If they're a thing in flat mount, which you probably have....

Might be a tempting option after all that hydraulic hassle. I was a hydraulic service technician, and I gave it away because hydraulic shit is a nightmare.

(Those nifty hybrid calipers excepted, since the hydraulics are self-contained)

I've definitely seen single shifters come up on ebay and on shop sites, maybe Madison or SJS or perhaps some of the German sites (I've bought odd Shimano spares from Rose before).

ie. bike24 seems to sell single sides
https://www.bike24.com/p2275590.html

I've got a set of very well used non-series shifters somewhere. Replacing both with older ones is another option but not one I'd do unless I was really skint. I'd probably buy GRX levers and then sell your old one as a spare.

Is it on a bike with full internal hoses?

yep :/

I do have another bike (105/TRP HY/RD mix which I've also had problems with, but it's currently working fine) but losing di2 seems... well, sad.

I think that's the non-di2 one isn't it. R8070 is electronic.

Just buy a replacement shifter. If the LBS gets it open and figures out what's going on, there's very little chance that Shimano will even do a spare for it, especially for 8070 which is discontinued. Best bet is a second hand one, or a single shifter from one of the various online places that sells single ones

Fuck putting HY/RD on it, that's the worst of both worlds

It says BR-R8070. My point is, they sell single shifters.

GRX single side option too
https://www.bike24.com/p2322961.html

losing di2

Didn't suggest that. But it sounds like your bike is hydraulic only, so my suggestion isn't worth a damn.

Fuck putting HY/RD on it, that's the worst of both worlds

Not sure how you get to that...

I spent five years fixing excavators and forklifts and shit, and I was a bike mechanic too. And I say, fuck hydraulics.

Except those nifty TRP calipers, which give you the self-adjustment, with virtually no expectation of hydro hassles. So you lose a bit of modulation with cables... But that's largely from housing compression, not so much cable stretch - that can be mitigated with beaded housing like Jagwire Elite Link or Nokon or something. Cable friction is another factor, but uncoated die-drawn is the go and nothing else, as any fule kno

Hydro ftw. Fuck cables.

Plainly ftl, in plasticniki's experience.

Both brakes failing at once! Not a great advertisement

"Right hand brake has always been a bit dodgy" = should've been a warranty claim to begin with?

I've got Shimano hydros on 5+ bikes and have been using them since my first TCR back in 2016. I'm pretty sure I've covered more miles than 99% of cyclists using them and the biggest drama I've had has always been my own fault, letting the pads run down and not taking spares. Oh, and someone put a screwdriver through a caliper once but I forgive him :)

I even sold my bleed kit because they just don't need to be redone.

(they'll fail in the middle of the Pyrenees now)

Fuck putting HY/RD on it

agree. i don't understand this forum's obsession with them

madison will be able to source you a spare shifter i am sure @plasticniki

should've been a warranty claim to begin with?

Probably. Maybe it wasn't always this way, I can't remember. Certainly wasn't an issue until the first time it needed bleeding which happened to be when I was touring through rural Wales with no bike shop in sight. Anyway. No bike shop I've ever taken it to (and it's been to a fuckload) ever suggested it may have been a warranty claim - which in hindsight I guess is a bit annoying (especially given I was given a new di2 battery under warranty in 2021). Anyway. Looks like I'll be spending £200+ on a flipping new shifter :'/

You should've asked on here first ;) #hippyisalwaysright

I guess you want to ride that bike. If time wasn't an issue but money was, I'd set up a saved searched on ebay for the model shifter you need and wait (while also looking for retailer deals).

I think my shifters are out of reach in storage, otherwise you could have them, even if to only tide you over until you found a cheap pair of GRX or Ultegras.

I'll have a full SRAM groupset off a Crux for sellz soon, but I guess that's a bit overkill for one dead shifter!

Reminds me; I need to get some pressure into a caliper and shifter to see if it’s worthwhile building an entire new bike around a shifter.