Sort-of memes that are cracking you up at the moment

See, now there's flippant posts in here too

A philosophy discussion thread already exists

Does a philosophy discussion thread exist if everyone has muted it?

I must write an extremely long post on that subject, which few people will understand, but everyone will nod sagely at for fear of being considered stupid.

I still can't make sense of the basics, how do people who accept there is no free will expect different outcomes?

nods sagely

Schrödinger's thread

Closely related to Russell Hobbs teapot.

I meme therefore your mum.

Bill Hicks isn't as good as Doug Stanhope

I saw Doug Stanhope live at the Prince Charles.

Jesus christ he was dark. Seriously fucking funny though.

Tbh I don't think you can really have these types of comedians anymore.

I saw him there too! I wish I could find a video of it. It was inspiring. But I think he ran out of inspiration and cynicism a few years after that. Maybe he grew up and got too successful. His ticket prices got huge. Anyway, back to the memes. I don't have any, so here's the 2018 ceremony in the library: https://twitter.com/MrMichaelSpicer/status/970606353080184832

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I believe our most reliable information, which indicates that's more or less the case; quantum fluctuations are dozens and dozens of orders of magnitude below the macro level. Sure, the quantum fluctuations determined the shape of our universe, but everything had to be in one place for that... Not much influence since.

Quantum events definitely have macro effects:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-event_upset#Notable_SEU

"stay in bed and watch cartoons"

I saw him in 92, this show
https://www.discogs.com/release/605401-Bill-Hicks-Shock-And-Awe-Live-At-Oxford-Playhouse-11-November-1992

Hooligans mocks us Brits wonderfully so. His routine about 'Gladiators' might still apply.

A single event upset?

Is that like when you get the shits after eating too much rich or spicy food and you think you're going to be at it all day but you just blast out one huge fountain of bum juice and you're back to feeling fine again?

I was front row centre, with my now wife, on a very early date. She has crippling anxiety of being the focus of attention, and somehow he knew that and directed an entire monologue directly at her. She didn't even blink as his rant spittle hit her.
And despite that, she still says it's the best comedy gig she's ever been too

But serious discussion should have moved past this point decades ago, if not for (even some of the smartest) people's stubborn refusal to integrate near certainties they find uncomfortable. We should be talking about the ethical implications of this all but inescapable realisation, and how to drag our primitive instinctual notions of morality towards something more evidence-based which would doubtless lead to better outcomes.

If you believe in a wholly deterministic universe, then surely talking about what we should be doing is moot. And feeling exasperated about society’s lack of interest in those ideas is as silly as it is inevitable.

I’m pretty sure derailing this thread is the meme at this point.

If you believe

Nail on head - he clearly doesn't. True belief in the absence of free will is a form of madness, sometimes a very dangerous form. It doesn't matter what metaphysics or quantum physics says about our being unable to influence the future, we must continue to believe that we can in order to remain sane.

True belief in the absence of free will is a form of madness, sometimes a very dangerous form. It doesn't matter what metaphysics or quantum physics says about our being unable to influence the future, we must continue to believe that we can in order to remain sane.

Exactly this. A thriving society with a rich culture and diverse economy could not exist without belief in free will. We would get depressed and just die

because free will as an illusion is a far harder concept to grasp and integrate than mortality, so the proportion of folks who actually manage that will always be minuscule.

I would add philosophy and quantum physics to the list of things that wouldn't exist if we didn't believe we had agency.

The second is refuted rather inescapably by special relativity; frames of reference certainly exist in which your future is in somebody else's past, strongly implying the future already exists, and that the perception of 'now' is a figment of awareness.

There is no observable proof that the future exists, or at least you haven't shown us any, so we live our lives as if it didn't exist, wether it exists or not. Both realities result in the same behaviour.

Not so much, even if you lack free will, the self reflection on the lack of free will and it's utterance onto a bike forum can all, and is all, part of the complex, predetermined spunk of matter that happened billions of years ago and despite your best efforts to or fro on these thoughts, all those atoms and electrons and whatever else flowing through your brain are just following their path to the end and being able to observe it is the wonderful confluence of a specific eddy on the way.

Parklife.

list of things that wouldn't exist if we didn't believe we had agency.

Also add prisons and punishment

Hmm. If society as a whole believed in determinism, and a few thought they had agency, society would probably lock them up.