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It takes a certain kind of cognitive dissonance to say you believe in social services while also saying you believe in liberalism.

I don't think you mean liberalism here. Liberalism, if we accept that Mill defined modern liberalism in his writings, would absolutely support social services as they clearly benefit the greater good.

Yeah. I suppose the whole "fiscally conservative, socially liberal" standpoint does assume that issues can be neatly separated into "economic" and "social" whereas the reality is much more blurred.

I'm not going to pretend to be an expert on classical liberalism. I thought it was tied pretty tightly to the belief in the free market and non-govt intervention. To me that would include laws against discrimination but is at odds with having a govt pumping money and resources in to social services.

It's a really difficult phrase just because it has such different meanings - liberal might be taken to mean neoliberal, basically right wing economic, or it might mean liberal in terms of individual rights (which might require state support). In the US 'the libs' are the democrats

It's also the basis of libertarianism which believes we should all return to planes Africa and become Monke

I don't think libertarianism does think that - libertarianism would push for no restrictions on immigration

Edit: maybe I misread your message, but I'm not really sure!

Well they don't believe that govt or oversight should exist as a thing so the logical conclusion is going back to living in caves with a barter economy.

I don't agree with libertarianism (at all, really) but this isn't really what they think...

But even if it was, all that really demonstrates is how 'liberal' has loads of really broad interpretations which aren't necessarily coherent

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4hGrm8kyPs

There's loads of these, it's always a libertarian who believe the govt shouldn't exist. Sam will ask them something like "how do you know your house isn't going to burn down because of bad electrics", the accept a bit of oversight is needed and it goes on from there

Yeah I am not saying I don't agree true libertarians are a bit mad - but they don't want to live in caves etc, they just have unrealistic views on what would happen in the absence of govt. And it's a spectrum - saying "they all think this" is a bit like when they say that anyone vaguely on the left wants full communism with no right to possessions

THE MARKET WILL DECIDE! people will vote with their pounds to buy the more expensive regulated product...

the market will decide!

The markets are deciding right now!

I think the markets have already decided.

In related news, I'm reading a good book at the moment:

Early analysis: Bears don't care about your feelings.

not like that!

I think libertarians like communists, anarchists and many other groups suffer from there never being a pure enough implementation for them to be satisfied it has been trialled correctly

Sure it's a spectrum but its starting point is already beyond the traditional conservative small government stance and firmly in the unrealistic zone. Much like Trussenomics.

Humans are always the issue with ideological concepts.

Oh yeah I agree, I just think 'liberal' is a way bigger term and covers quite different stances (Inc lots of progressive ones)

Humans are always the issue

.

Mogg being Mogg and preemptively discrediting the OBR forecast of the impact of the mini budget
https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1580256383898771456

He makes that comment in the spirit of collective responsibility I trust?
So his comments are deemed to be the Cabinet opinion of the yet to be released OBR report
As opposed to spouting off like the cunt lickspittely self serving wanker that it actually is
Apologies, that was a little unbalanced
“As the cunt lickspittley self serving wanker observed, as anonymous sources have reported”

Edit
And yes, ‘It’
As opposed to humanising with a ‘him’

Conspiracy theorist Alex Jones ordered to pay victims' families $965m

Fucking lol

Away from our shower of cunts, Alex Jones has to pay$965m dollars damages to Sandy Hook families. Good. Hope he is destitute for life.

Damn you @Soul!