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Trickledown sounds like some sort of sordid pron term, kind of appropriate really.

Aka: The mess created by Kwasi Kwarteng...

With the thanks you get from the home office omnishambles / gutter press and BrexShit/ randomly changing immigration rules perhaps better this tradedeal happens when the government actually appreciates us Furrin's / the HO is less toxic?

A colleague of mine married his HK partner for which he had to renounce his UK citizenship and get married under EU rules (NI born) cos other his now husband would have been kicked out as May changed the student visa rules.

Also, lol.

the problem is this is the Dave down the pub

Don't forget your kid Dave.

#rep for this.

Yes - that is exactly what her spokesperson has just 'clarified'.

I don't believe progressive conservatism exists outside of studies. You may get people saying they belive in social progressivism and economic liberalism but they're fundamentally at odds with each other. It takes a certain kind of cognitive dissonance to say you believe in social services while also saying you believe in liberalism.

We did this argument here the other day. The word "progressive" has two important but distinct meanings in this context

Fiscally progressive = redistribution from rich to poor through tax/spend, commitment to equality of outcome etc
Socially progressive = anti-discrimination, pro LGBT+ rights etc, anti-class system

The second of these is absolutely compatible with liberalism, i.e. government can't tell me what my gender or sexual orientation is, or what I can do with my body (e.g. abortion).

https://qz.com/936052/you-cant-be-socially-progressive-and-economically-conservative/

I don't believe progressive conservatism exists outside of studies

Government of Austria. A right wing and green coalition government. Cunts over immigration and all the usual populist and right wing nonsense, however they push progressive policies particularly around social investment and the environment.

• Harsh tax regime for operators and users of non green transport.
  
• Harsh tax regime and planning hurdles for non renewables. Tax breaks and investment support for green schemes.
  
• The Kilmabonus. Every Austrian receives a cash payment on an annual basis, calculated on how envrionmentally friendly your region has been in the previous year. 500 euros per person this year. https://www.klimabonus.gv.at/en/
  
• Large investment budget for childcare, social care, eldercare.
  
• Large investment budget for youth services and sports/wellbeing
  
• Largest education budget in Europe.
  
  

Edit: Just to add, they enjoy 90% approval of public services, 75% for education. This helps.

I'd argue that fiscal conservatism is at odds with spending money on the social aspect but a coalition govt could do all kinds of unusual things.

who is Mike Epifani?

like trippling the cost of university fees then selling the loans to hedge funds

Don't know, don't care. Just couldn't be bothered to type out what he's already written.

I'd argue that fiscal conservatism is at odds with spending money on the social aspect but a coalition govt could do all kinds of unusual things.

Fair.

My point still stands though. Austria is a mostly right wing country with a right of centre government, but is in the top 10 most productive countries in the world with a high citizen happiness rating and low poverty levels. IMHO, this comes from deacdes of investing in the whole of society and not just pumping money to corporations and the mega rich. They appear to be unafraid to take a long term view when it comes to policy.

I'd add you mention progressive conservatism is growing through Europe, you know what else is growing? The power of right wing parties. Ignoring the pros/cons of actually having a right wing party in power they often go for the stance of anti-immigration but good national support for "familes". Of course that often means "traditional families" and anything outside a man-woman marriage with 3 kids is discouraged and support for the disabled can be Darwinian. E.g. Hungary.

E.g. Hungary.

And Austria...not sure there is anywhere harder to be a non native in Europe than in Austria.

Don't mistake me pointing out that conservative governments have started to realise that there is more prosperity and money to be made if you've got a happy, healthy and wealthy population for me condoning them or saying that these governments are good governments.

I'm more trying to point out that our Conservatives are going against the grain with the trickle down bullshit.

It's extra dumb. I don't get it.

It's extra dumb. I don't get it

I honestly reckon its quite simple:

Long termist policies to grow the wealth and prosperity of the country. Populism to try to win elections.

vs

Shot termist policies to grow the wealth of your donors and lobbyists and populism to try to win elections.

Initiatives that foster social progress either cost taxpayer money, require governmentally enforced regulation, or both. If there’s no social progress funding, there’s no social progress.

After he contradicted himself in his first paragraph I kind of lost interest. If you accept that governmentally-enforced regulation can foster social progress then I don't see why supporting such regulation (or deregulation) cannot in and of itself be described as progressive.

If your goal is just to make some cash why bother with the stress of running for/becoming PM. It's like these people assume that they're so important their life calling is to be telling other people what to do. Hubris.

Isn't that the point? Govt regulation can foster social progression, for example anti-discimination laws. That's at odds with fiscal conservatism which wants to deregulate and remove "red tape" from businesses such as equal opportunities laws.

fiscal conservatism which wants to deregulate and remove "red tape" from businesses such as equal opportunities laws

To me, the word "fiscal" has a really specific meaning, i.e. tax and spend. Therefore I would say that measures to do with regulation don't really have a fiscal dimension? Maybe I'm splitting hairs though. If you were to say laissez-faire then I would agree with you.

But don't forget the situations where deregulation is the progressive position (i.e. anti-trans / choice laws).

Sure in a "fiscal policy" way that's what it means but in a political idealogical way to me fiscal conservatism means deregulation, free market ideals, neoliberal bullshit, slave labour as a goal etc.