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  • Thanks challenge off the list then. They were by the most expensive on the list anyway. Never used a vredstein but I'll check them out

  • The old vredestein fortezza tri comp used to be my favourite.

    I haven't tried their direct replacement, the fortezza senso all weather, but i've recently put some of their open tubulars on. They're absolutely excellent, like the old vittoria open corsas, but with grippier rubber. I've been running challenge tyres for the last 4 or 5 years and they tend to be less grippy in wet weather and are absolute pigs to fit. If you want a nice fast 25mm winter tyre maybe open pave?

  • I always used to use cosa clinchers and tubs in summer and open paves in winter and loved them. I didn't think there was a tubeless pave replacement since they stopped doing the black and green clinchers. So a tubeless equivalent of that is what I'm after really. Google says the corsa g+ is the replacement but I've no experience with vittorias since they released the graphine like 5 years ago. I'm right out of touch with the current crop

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