Chat about Novel Coronavirus - 2019-nCoV - COVID-19

I’m going to assume two things; one you don’t under go risk assessment for work and two you don’t work with data.
I’d genuinely like to try help you but unfortunately I can’t see how.
Good luck with your decisions.

I honestly don't understand what you are trying to get at. why don't you help me out by explaining this risk assessment of yours. What I understand from your previous post is you think you are fit to work until you are hospitalised with covid.

Best thing to do is just ignore the troll every time they pop up once a week.

Best thing to do is just ignore the troll every time they pop up once a week.

Agreed. This thread is the first time I have used the ignore feature.

Wow, I know I can be dangerously half informed about Covid stuff but the claim that the numbers show you are more likely to get Covid if you are vaccinated really takes the biscuit.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simpson%27s_paradox

I’ll try once more.

This is the full table. Your selective crop supports your argument. However when viewed with the other data in the table and considering the fact numbers are unadjusted. It seems unlikely that vaccination and or a booster puts people, in your example NHS staff, in a worse position. Again NHS staff isolating is not directly linked to severity of illness, it’s as a result of a positive test.

As previously mentioned, I’d suggest using the hospitalisations and death columns as a better representation than a positive case. Because they have parameters that the first column does not.
You are using the weakest data point in the table to assert your point.
Once you use either column (and I think you already partly agree) your hypothesis falls down. You are indeed better vaccinated.

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I disagree Ed. There are plenty of people who feel the same way as @8b - calling them a troll and ignoring isn't going to change anyone's mind. I'm not sure whether some of the arguments on here will make a difference, but there are plenty of people now getting vaccinated that haven't up to now so for me it is worth engaging if in good faith.
There are valid discussions to be had about the effectiveness of restrictions/vaccinations etc as this pandemic goes on - it's not going to go away for a while yet - and what we are willing to accept as a society to adapt to it.

The difference tho is constantly ignoring what people are trying to explain, and continued with the same hypothesis.

Yeah fine line though.
It’s certainly going to be a rocky road as we transition out of this, to an extent we are already finding that!

Does no one look at the current fear led booster campaign and think its all a bit crazy?

What's your explanation for why almost all governments and senior medical people want young people to get vaccinated?

On the bright side the coronavirus dashboard appears to be complete today, no missing date from anywhere.

I don't think its coincidence that chart has been knocking around in anti-vax and covid denier Facebook groups for a while. I think the UKHSA made a statement about it recently, to try to clear up some of the confusion.

On the bright side the coronavirus dashboard appears to be complete today, no missing date from anywhere.

And barring any back to school suprises, the rate of case growth seems to be just starting to slow a bit. Would be great if a peak is reached next week.

Edit: Although it still looks like reported cases numbers aren't particularly useful due to the testing issues amongst other things but hopefully at least the rates should be reliable. The ONS data indicates that they might be.

Yes of course thats possible but to me its complete madness that vaccinated covid positive staff are working in hospitals when unvaccinated Covid negative staff are fired and not allowed to work.

It just gets to show how bad the staffing issues are. I agree people should not be fired if they are not vaccinated if there is testing/they were really good masks.

I'm really wary of vaccine mandates. I'm not sure if I'm wary enough to be opposed to them but it's close.

However, when I worked for the NHS I was required to have multiple vaccines, chest x-rays to look for Tb, an HIV test for one particular role, as a condition of employment and I think that it's not unreasonable to mandate vaccines for people who work in a job that has contact with people who are vulnerable. If I had refused to have my vaccines, the NHS would not have offered me a job.

I know that if I was immune compromised, I would not want to be treated by somebody who has not had the vaccine because even with regular testing and masks, they could kill me.

Sure, let a train driver or an office work opt out...but somebody who's vocation or profession is to protect the vulnerable? No way.

Yeah, I agree, I am strongly against vaccine mandates, but I can absolutely see that they might be necessary for some healthcare roles.

I could not care less if people who are not vaccinated are inconvenienced.

If I had refused to have my vaccines, the NHS would not have offered me a job.

I think NHS staff should be required to be vaccinated but there is a difference between something that was in the T&Cs before you applied and something that is added while you work there.

The problem with the COVID vaccines is that they have failed to stop the transmission of Omicron in the UK. Why would we insist on vaccination for the protection of health care users when the vaccines all seem to be ineffective at stopping transmission to those users?

As far as I can see the only effective control on transmission is total draconian lockdown. The additional restrictions and mandates in Scotland and Wales have resulted in no real difference in transmission compared with England.

obvious troll is obvious.

My points are valid re vaccination. The UK has world leading levels of vaccination but Omicron cases were doubling every day.

The UK has world leading levels of vaccination

No it doesn't.

I understand vaccination reduces transmission. Should you require something that doesn't eliminate a hazard but reduces it a lot/bit? I think so.

The problem with the COVID vaccines is that they have failed to stop the transmission of Omicron in the UK.

Okay help me out here.

The whole point of the vaccination is to reduce the transmission as well as the severity of the virus(es), is this correct?

And what haa happened to the death rates, compared to wave 1? Especially in the clinically vulnerable older cohorts...

Nothing to worry about

Just catching up, I notice post #7 was cited a few pages back.

Not my finest prediction

I think the reason most got vaccinated is because they thought it could stop the old n fragile from getting the virus in the first place and so that things could get back to normal in terms of day to day life if we were all vaccinated enough. This now seem to be completely out the window considering the infections rate amongst the worlds best vaccinated populations like israel for example. Vaccination has failed in this regard thanks to the new variant.

It does show a great deal of protection from serious impacts from the virus when you have caught it but again thats a completely different thing. That wont end the pandemic it seems. Nor will it make day to day life go back to normal.

I read today that the infection rates were more or less the same with omnicron between the vaccinated and the unvaccinated. If this turns out to be true which does not seem all that far fetched considering the explosion of numbers seen all over the world then the reason for beeing vaccinated today and continue to vaccinate yourself with booster shots will be a very different proposition than the one we made a year ago. At least for me it will.

Remember that swedish epedemic dr giseke or similar who claimed we were all going to get it in interviews like 2 years ago or somtin. Turns out he may be right just his timeline was way off :/

In sweden now, which i know u know have had it pretty laid back considering we did not change our way of life as much as uk for example, ppl dont really bother to take distance in the same way the did say a year ago despite knowing that the virus is at the highest level since the start of the pandemic. I would assume this is in part because they feel protected by the vaccines and that is ofc true but if we want to stop the spread a much better way would be to order harder lock downs than to mandate more vaccination that does not seem to stop the infection rates very much. Yet our government does not seem to remind ppl of distancing and working from home to the same extent they did previously but they consider vaccination mandates for entering restaurants and shops etc. Just dont seem very logical to me at least.

Just a crappy situation all around no matter how and what you do i guess.