Overheard at the LFGSS golf club bar

they are called independent schools?

I think independent schools have a slightly different administration model, like they’re a charity or something? Otherwise they’re a ‘public’ school, eg Eton.

Would be glad to be corrected if someone knows the differenceZ

I used to know the IT Manager for a private school fairly well, went down to see him to discuss stuff quite often - and as part of that we’d discuss the school. He was sending both his kids to a local comprehensive, despite both being eligible for the (highly) reduced fees that the school offered for the staff.

His view was that the overall academic performance for pupils without behavioral issues* was no better than public education - but in terms of sports, activities and forming a group of friends who would likely be in positions of influence in future there was no comparison.

For example they had sports classes daily, and they had all the kit and infrastructure - rather than a bag of footballs on a Wednesday afternoon being all you could hope for.

* In this case the academic difference was a chasm

but in terms of sports

I used to play rugby for Old Alleynians, the club that used to only exist for ex-Dulwich College pupils. They "opened their doors" in the 80's I think, hence me being able to play there. But still, there is a deep link to the school (grounds rented from them, a ton of actual old boys still registered etc.). We used to use the school's facilities if our club was rained out or if there were too many home games on. Seeing what they had at the school just for rugby, was nuts. I never even got to count all the pitches, or how many different changing rooms or changing room buildings there were. They also have a big sports centre which is like an expensive leisure centre. Kids come out of there at 18 like professional athletes (along with all their other problematic personality traits).

Dulwich College have produced a fair few Rugby internationals. I think they had three England players in one squad at one point.

I used to work for Old Alleynians, as a coach. Not for Rugby though.

Alleyns School has impressive facilities too, although not quite on the same scale.

Basically your choices are:

• Comprehensive
  
• Grammar / selective state schools
  
• Private/Independent
  
• Public schools
  
• home school
  
  

While public schools are private, they usually (but not always) refer to the older well known and more expensive schools like Eton, Harrow, etc. that are largely boarding school. Fees for those are >£30k vs £10-15k for regular private schools. The breadth of the market means you can choose quite specifically what you want for your kid in terms of style of education. Most will be selective so you will still need to coach your kid even for primary.

Selective state schools often have a private school vibe with trad. values, more sport, more able pupils. Typically you buy your way into the right catchment area, or rent in one until you've got your eldest enrolled, then pay for tuition to coach your kids for an exam called the 11+. However, that is no longer the win it used to be as there are more kids competing. So if you want to go that route you've probably got to start training your kids from at least 9yo and looking at extra curricular activities to make them stand out. Musical instruments are prised by most of those schools, so that is currently a good option.

Comprehensives are normal state schools that vary based on all the factors you'd expect.

Anyone can home school their kid.

As mentioned sport and ex curricular activities are a major difference. Even arty private schools will have a 3-4hrs a week.

7% of UK children attend a school in the private sector, 35% of medalists at Tokyo attended a private school for at least some of their schooling.

Lols in Nigel Farrage

You can absolutely, 100% and without any hint of regret, jealousy, class anxiety, snobbery judge someone or their parents for going/ sending their kid to private school, hell even a grammar school.

You can make well reasoned arguments for how the outcomes are similar for comp and private/ grammar when adjusted for social factors in the uk, even better for comp in some cases, you can make further arguments how the institutions are discriminatory and actively hurt comp students. One could even suggest they hurt the private school students too.

But above all, morally, Shits archaic, the only logical argument paying for them is for the school name on the kids background to which a future employer may double look at their cv (as long as they have a good Christian name and are not a woman). Going there isn’t even a multiplier for your kids success if you’re some middle manager IT goon struggling to send your kid private, you’re never going to be invited down the local conservative meeting for crackers or some shit. it might impress your reports who “wish they could work to be in your position one day, sending their kids to private school and some mid level 3 series”. but that private school committee is going to milk you for all you got and not even remember your kids name when the fees stop, they’re poaching the fat cats, socialites, and celebs, they couldn’t care about some white collar schmuck

You’re mugging yourself off. And your kids going to get bullied, Rightfully, when they end up in the same fucking mid table red brick uni and some comprehensive Chad finds out half way through the ring of fire and proclaims, very loudly that your kid is dumb as fuck and shat themselves last night while ringing “mother” that they’d spent the terms stipend. Another, comprehensive queen will then shout “I saw them fucking Googling “what is a Tory!”, they’ll resent themselves and you. It will be very funny for all involved outside of that.

You could, instead of course, recognise a child's outcome is much more reliant on the resources and personal care afforded them, send them to the local comp, take an interest in what they want to do, provide for their hobbies and take them on holiday, let them be surrounded by a bunch of people, maybe even let them fuck up, be a bit of a dick. Maybe put the money aside for when it matters, ie supporting your child to be comfortable in university and post university to pursue further education or lucrative job opportunities which don’t make any real sense but will grow them as people. At the end of the day, if your kid has someone with private school money for a parent, they’re going to just fine. So why engage in a system that’s only there to fuck over everyone else in some weird fucked up hunger games. I mean, ofc you might agree that fucked up hunger games is “actually good”, but if that’s you? Your kid has other problems bigger than school.

Plenty of issues with comps, catchments, and funding inequality etc, private and grammar solves none of this, sending your kid to your local comp does.

Aye, Nick Easter, Andrew Sheridan and David Flatman were regularly down giving coaching sessions or speaking at the excruciating annual dinners.

We would also have semi-regular matches against the leaving 1st XV team at our club. Every year they'd trash our clubhouse, because they could. I'm sure there are some well rounded alumni, but there is a lot of toxic masculinity and entitlement coming out of that place. They are actively taught they are better than everyone else, and it shows.

Are there state vs. private school studies that look at 10 years post graduation?
Most of the private school kids I knew at uni were so spoon-fed during school they struggled when they had to do everything themselves. But then if they've got better contacts, their uni performance might've ended up irrelevant anyway. Maybe it was just the dropkicks that gravitated towards me though and the highflyers were busy elsewhere.

imo just spend quality time with your kids and encourage them to pick up the reading habit by reading to them often - save yourself a lot of wonga

It's such a hard thing to control for though.

I think someone found some data that showed secondary school, specifically 6th form had the biggest determiner for future performance, but that was largely a factor of going to the top universities.

provide for their hobbies and take them on holiday.... Maybe put the money aside for when it matters, ie supporting your child to be comfortable in university and post university to pursue further education or lucrative job opportunities which don’t make any real sense but will grow them as people.

So using your wealth to secure advantages for your kids is morally OK as long as it's spent on these things. Got it.

They are actively taught they are better than everyone else, and it shows.

Couldn't agree more. Some of my dearest friends are DC alumni. None of them are sending their kids there, or to any private school for that matter. Simply because they know what it's like.

Apparently it has fallen a long way in terms of academic results and entry requirements in the last 25 years or so, no idea how true that is.

I think the Farage effect might be a thing there - he's the most famous alumni (or, rather, he's the only one I know of).

Producing leather toothed facists is not the best advert for your school.

send your kid(s) here user amey u coward

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Thank you for your moral clarity and ideological purity, commissar. You are a lesson to us all.

having looked at some fees I know for certain I cannot afford them, so not even a choice for my kid.

Cutting your annual spend on cycling by 50% should sort you out

start training your kids from at least 9yo and looking at extra curricular activities to make them stand out

Jesus

Yeah, back home too. If you're shit at exams for whatever reason, your uni entry is gonna be fucked up. But then a tonne of people drop out of 1st year anyway.

In Buckinghamshire, entrance to selective state schools ("grammar schools") is 100% on performance in the 11+, extra-curricular stuff e.g. music plays no part whatsoever

Yeah, if you can’t tell the difference between a perpetual system of unequal schooling based solely on exclusion and historical elitism vs paying for your kid to do karate lessons on a whim and not having to work 20 hours in a supermarket a week I don’t know what to tell you lol

We do live in a society, but we can choose not to engage with the worst parts of it

What do you say to a friend who announces they're sending their little darling to a private school?

"I knew it!"

Tricky - just knowing such an individual will reduce your social credit, best to immediately scrub them from your life and deny any knowledge.

Totally anecdotally, I went to state school and my little brother went to private. He did much more/better sports than me, wasn't bullied, is happy and well adjusted, lives a great life, earns lots of money etc. Whereas I do not. Maybe school choice is nothing to do with it but I think being really unhappy for 7 years wasn't amazingly good for me.

School fees in the UK are ridiculous, but international day schools here (in Shanghai) are around £40k a year... All the parents are teachers, on massive expat packages or are filthy rich shanghainese that bought passports for the whole family and don't notice small change like that.