Dammit’s adventures in mountain biking

We'd have no relativity if Einstein had spent all his time bleeding magura brakes rather than rigourously interrogating the problem for years

Had a roll around to find dinner and rear brake is working well.

I had to take the brake off the frame to send the frame to Pace.

Sorry to keep poking fun at your endless Magura woes…. It’s just too hard to resist! You know I’m just trolling you.

But seriously though…. At what point do you admit defeat and just replace with whatever Shimano/SRAM option is suitably top of the range?

Hope you manage to get them working well enough to just enjoy some riding on your holiday!

Did I mention that I am quite stubborn?

I sent Magura (via their Facebook chat) the link to this thread from the point that it largely turns into my adventures with MT7’s.

I think it’s time for reverse psychology

@dammit stick with the maguras

Reckon they’ll get to a max 6 comments in before sighing and exclaiming why the fuck hasn’t he sent them back.

My response to that would be they need to work on the bike, which means they need to be installed, which means the bleeding issue needs to be resolved.

The front, which I have bled, works perfectly.

There’s something about the setup for the rear I think that makes it problematic- but I can’t see what that is.

And saying “just send the brake in” does nothing to resolve the actual problem, I think.

Got a spare caliper to swap?

Yes, a brand new one complete system (calliper/hose/lever). If the future resembles the past it will work perfectly once installed until it is bled for the first time, when it will be impossible to fully remove all the air. Just changing the calliper will run straight into the “can’t bleed it completely” problem.

But if it works back at their HQ the fault is with the fitting/fitter then no?

Yes, but then what to do? If no one can fit the brake in such a way that it works then it’s not very useful.

I (and the Morgins pro-shop, and Pace’s mechanic) must all be making the same mistake, despite following the instructions provided by Magura. What is the mistake?

Could the action of the suspension cycling be putting tension on the banjo and moving it, introducing air? If so, should I over-torque it? I used the Magura specified torque when installing it.

Although that doesn’t explain why you can’t bleed it when the bike is in the stand. Hmm.

Reckon they’ll get to a max 6 comments in before sighing and exclaiming why the fuck hasn’t he sent them back.

I reckon they'll read the whole thread, start sobbing, then send him some XTR 4 pots & ask him never to speak of their brand again. A shadowy figure will come round in the night to remove all traces of Magura products from the house & a blank cheque will be left in place. It'll be like it never happened.

Hope this gets resolved - looks like you're having fun in the Tweed Valley regardless of the brake woes, not been to GT for ages, the blue descent is great - and sadly about as much as my knees will take these days

it will work perfectly once installed until it is bled for the first time

So…install it and then never bleed it? It doesn’t need bleeding until it stops working perfectly…and if it only stops working perfectly when it is bled…

(That said, I’m sure changing an entire brake line isn’t exactly how you wanted to spend your holiday)

I don't know about internal routing do maybe there is a gotcha that wouldn't work but could you temporarily install with external routing / zip ties etc, ride it, detach everything again one by one- lever then caliper rebleed using all the kit and techniques.
If it's ok like that you would at least know you've been doing everything right and the brakes and bleed are not the problem and it's something inside the frame.

How good is the syringe you are using? Whilst they may seem to be able to compress air, surely they are not designed to be pneumatically tight? Could air be leaking past the plunger? And (in before "everyone uses syringes"), that coupled with either less than perfect technique (soz) and particularly stubborn brakes = bike mechanics in the hotel car park.

So…install it and then never bleed it? It doesn’t need bleeding until it stops working perfectly…and if it only stops working perfectly when it is bled…

(That said, I’m sure changing an entire brake line isn’t exactly how you wanted to spend your holiday)

Issue there is that it makes a £180 brake a single use item. I suppose it means you don’t need to buy brake pads anymore, but still feels a bit Golf Club++.

And, in direct contravention of our forum Mrs Havershams insistence on where the only acceptable money comes from, I’m sorry to report that I’m not an heir to a fortune made from the slave trade.

When you pull the plunger back you can see (clear tube) air bubbling out of the calliper, along said tube, into the syringe. It’s clear that it’s coming from the calliper (Fenella can confirm this).

What’s interesting is that on the push, air doesn’t go up the brake line and emerge from the lever. Which makes me think that maybe air is being sucked in past seals in the calliper. I’m increasingly suspecting the banjo, possibly due to Mumford and Sons.

"Banjo" brought other things to mind for me, possibly due to a not too distant medical procedure. But anyway, that hopefully has nothing to do with your brakes.

But that single use is....a really long time?

there are definitely circumstances where you need to break the brake line (for instance, if you have to send your frame back to the manufacturer for them to take a look at some damage) and do a bleed as a result, but otherwise there aren't many circumstances under which you should need to bleed your brakes. Until you start to experience loss of performance, in which case bleed the brakes. Or, in the case of Maguras apparently, you throw them away and get new ones.

This could work. Get them to send you new ones. Mount them with external routing and ride it like that for a while, see if they keep working. At least then you know for sure there is nothing wrong with the brake itself. Then you could install them with internal wiring, do the bleeding voodoo and see if they still work.