Gravel / Gravé / Gnarmac / Groad / ATB

Me too.
Manchester? WTF...

Fab pub! I grew up in the shadow of Hartshead Pike but only picked up cycling properly when I moved to Leeds, so missed out on a load of 01fix1 action.

Stopping now

Everyone knows Manchester is the first city really, but why would you bother heading to Birmingham or London once you get to Manchester?

What tube line is Manchester on?

why would you bother heading to Birmingham

Why would you head to Birmingham? You wouldn't, because deep down you are already there

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxZ1xn2ml10

imo, the bridal path under spaghetti junction is some of the most premium gravel riding in the uk, a brutalist vision and fishtank grav, dream combo.

it's a shame they destroyed the old library

Head west of Birmingam and Shropshire has endless dreamgravel.

spaghetti junction

I drove over it this morning. In the wind and rain. The mix of animated advertising and StayHomeSaveLives DriveInTheHardShoulderYouPussy and COVID-19 testing demands (for foreign travel) made me feel like a right replicant.

Thanks for linking this, fantastic

it's a shame they destroyed the old library

Gravel really does have a lot to answer for

bridal

Surely Brum is always the bridesmaid?

destroyed the old library

honestly breaks my heart. was such a beautiful bit of architecture.

spag junction is fantastic.

Sizing question. If my carbon race bike and my Fairlight Strael with the same setup, 54cm with a 110mm stem and it works for me. Should I be looking for the same reach in 'gravel' bike geo or something different?

From what I can see, in general, if reach remains the same, stack is increased due to a higher front end, and due to the seat tube angles, the effective TT is longer on gravel geo.

Would this mean matching the reach is the best option? I don't want to end up with a gravel bike with a massive long stem, but assume that the longer effective TT will correct for this.

When I got my gravel bike I chose the same geometry as my road bike. This is great when riding the gravel bike on the road, but it's not so good off-road. The problems are:

1. slow handling on single track due to long stem
   
2. too low position when descending in drops (you need to be in the drops for better braking power)
   
   

... so my advice is plan for a stem that is 10-20mm shorter and a stack that is 20-40mm higher than road. You want the final reach to be roughly the same though

My Kinesis Tripster went from TABR setup to Badlands setup by changing tyres to 700x50, using a 42T instead of a 36T cassette and sticking flat pedals on. Only position change was slight saddle height adjustment to deal with going from Speedplay to flat shoes.

Since its proper 'gravel conversion' it now has 650x50 tyres, 44cm instead of 38cm bars and the stem is 20mm shorter (to compensate for the wider bars). It currently has Speedplays on it so the saddle height is back to road setup.

Thanks, that is really helpful. I notice that if reach stays the same, effective TT is longer on a gravel bike. I've always gone with reach/stack, but with the saddle further back (due to seat tube angle) does effective TT become more of a factor?

You want to rotate the fit. So a slacker ST is a help (all else being equal).

A lot of people go for wider bars so shorten the reach for that also.

This stuff becomes difficult if you’re only using stack and reach measurements. But you can also measure a saddle point - hoods etc.

I think the distance of the saddle relative to the BB should not change. This position should be determined by your body's center of mass. You want the weight roughly balanced between handlebars and saddle correctly. (Conventional wisdom is 60/4o I think)

Ignore the seat tube angle, you can compensate for this with an inline / layback post and moving the saddle along the rails.

From a fast road position? Does not compute. How are you going to maintain your arbitrary 60/40 with the same effective ST angle and the longer front-center of the gravel bike? Are you going to lower the rider over the front end?

Moving from road to off road positions usually become less static because of different terrain. That’s reason to look again at all your road measurements. Of course a good starting point is probably your road measurements on a frame with some further possibilities for adjustment.

@cozey you forgot bikefit!

january - PDFs
february - gears (2 by Vs 1 by Vs 0 by)
march - carbon forks with mounts
april - dynamo setups
may - 650b v 700c
june - new S/S21 shimano / crocs SPD collab
july - "should I just buy a hardtail?"
august - "I bought a hardtail, what now?"
sept - optimum bar width
oct - A/W21 PDF season
nov - heated flask setups
dec - horses (again)

Nice. I used to live near there. Loads of great riding in that area.

please see updated schedule below:

january - PDFs
february - gears (2 by Vs 1 by Vs 0 by)
march - bikefit
april - shit from a butt
may - shit from a butt
june - dry shit from a butt*
july - dry shit from a butt*
august - dry shit from a butt*
sept - dry shit from a butt*
oct - shit from a butt
nov -shit from a butt
dec - horses (again)

*for users in scotland conversation will continue to focus on wet shit from a butt in these months

same effective ST angle

by moving the saddle up/down and forward/back

longer front-center

im talking about weight on the bars, saddle and pedals, not the wheels

Edit: I think we are agreeing though, TBH...