Chat about Novel Coronavirus - 2019-nCoV - COVID-19

I can completely understand a couple’s concerns about fertility, but I don’t think there is anything about the vaccine that indicates any concerns? Is it another conspiracy theory?

As far as I know, yes. I'm not sure where it came from. Possibly mRNA is a bit like DNA and DNA shenanigans happens in baby making as documented in Twins (1988).

I don't think it's just a scare tactic. It depends who you are. If you're an individual then a slight increase to your chance of death, from 1% to 1.3%, should not be extremely scary.

If you are running the government or a hospital then 30% more patients could be absolutely catastrophic.

"It will make you infertile" says my nephews care home working fiancé. Apparently causing quite a lot of tension in their relationship at the moment. The majority of staff at the care home she works at are planning to refuse.

That's quite the claim requiring quite the evidence.

Edit: Twins. I see. Can't argue with that!

I'd say you shouldn't be allowed to work in care homes without being vaccinated once the roll out is complete but they're already understaffed with underpaid staff so I'm not sure how helpful that would be.

As an individual male over 60 my chances of dying go up 30%, its just diluted by the rest of the population....

Care home staff recruitment has got even harder due to a combination of our poor handling of Covid (staff from abroad returning home where it is safer) and Brexit which makes it hard to be picky.

If you are running the government or a hospital then 30% more patients could be absolutely catastrophic.

That's not what the stat means, though - and this is perhaps a good reason why using it is problmeatic. I.e., it's not an increase in 30% more patients. It's an increase in fatalities of those who have caught the virus (again, a fraction of percent). The vast majority of these deaths would, I expect, be amongst people who were already in the hospital. That doesn't mean it's not a worrying statistic if true.

Having said that, the new variant has resulted in more hospitalizations due to the increase in transmissions, it would appear. We've known this since (at least) December, however.

I haven't had a conversation with her or even my nephew about this so I'm not sure what her source of concern is. I'd hope she would be reassured by things like https://www.nursingtimes.net/news/coronavirus/no-evidence-covid-19-vaccine-will-affect-fertility-say-unions-21-01-2021/ but events like the Thalidomide scandal have cast a long shadow.

Seems unlikely that only mortality would increase in isolation

"It will make you infertile"

That's the plot of Utopia.

Is this a movie?

It's an excellent TV show, and I recently discovered both seasons are available on Amazon Prime. Worth watching if you have it.

Edit: Watch the original Channel 4 series from 2013, not the US remake.

Yeah I’ve seen it.

I meant: is this a movie?

Oh, sorry. Got excited about introducing someone new to Utopia.

I mean, it's not a million miles away is it. We're just missing the heroes who save the world from the evil network.

There's going to be a plague of pandemic based shows in the next few years, won't there?

There’s already one about COVID-23, featuring a courier trying to reach somewhere.

Edited; Songbird

COVID-13 was set in Paris and had parkour in it I think

First world problem, pushed back our august 2020 wedding again from June 21 to July 2022 today, one day it will happen..

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/jan/23/uk-bosses-set-up-it-systems-to-track-covid-vaccine-status-of-staff

UK bosses set up IT systems to track Covid vaccine status of staff

...

Meanwhile, Barchester Healthcare, which runs more than 200 care homes in the UK, has said it will not hire anyone who had refused the vaccine for non-medical reasons.

However, firms that sack or sideline employees who refuse to take the vaccine may be vulnerable to claims of discrimination or unfair dismissal, according to Jeremy Coy, a solicitor specialising in employment at Russell-Cooke.

Surely a dynamic and accurate educational programme is in order with the gov being held accountable long term for any misguidance? Take responsibility, stand by the roll out, restrict misinformation....

The decision of an individual lawyer doesn't really have any meaning. I've heard other lawyers give the opposite opinion. The ultimate answer will be had through a legal ruling from a judge (and probably after appeals going all the way up to whichever is the highest court for this kind of thing).

Unless someone has a genuine specific reason (health most likely for a few, religion possibly but can't see how it would be against most common religions as there are no animal products) for declining a vaccine then it's unlikely to be illegal to use it to discriminate against potential employees. It may be different for existing employees (e.g. you can't sack someone for refusing to have the vaccine). The individual job may matter too.

My niece got jabbed today (Pfizer). She's a 5th year medic currently working in an ICU along with most of her fellow students.

None of what he’s saying tallies with any other medical projections though... that’s some extremely out on a limb shit!

It’s a joke

Well, an attempt at one.