Chat about Novel Coronavirus - 2019-nCoV - COVID-19

As an aside is there any UK gov info about testing wastewater? Here they have been testing it since March and as I understand it are using it to estimate the real spread of COVID not just from testing. They use the info to decide preventative measures rather than react to new cases.

We need an r rate sweep stake. My guess is we won’t get it below 1 with these measures, I’m going with 1.1.

Cummings absolutely fucked the chance of any future lockdowns working with his family trip to Barnard Castle, what a mess.

Furlough scheme extended through to March, I think this is a mistake. There will be a lot of jobs that simply won't be viable post covid (or at least not in as great numbers) so I don't see the benefit of people hanging on to at-risk jobs. Should be securing incomes, not jobs.

You wouldn’t be saying that if you being made redundant imminently.

As an aside is there any UK gov info about testing wastewater?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54646451
Covid: Sewage sites to test for more traces of virus
Published 23 October

I'm not saying just cast people adrift, replace the furlough with a generous basic income for an extended period of time that doesn't tie people into waiting for jobs that may not exist further down the line.

+1 Shops & traffic by Chorlton Park same as usual.

It may politically be easier?

Universal Credit is so poor many people with mortgages etc. (not the "traditionally poor") and skilled jobs have to go to the foodbank after paying their bills.

A known issue Tories refused to address when it came up years ago.

But Sinak has the power and will to extend furlough. I am not disagreeing with you btw, I just suspect that may be a factor.

(R of) Ireland introduced a temporary UBI instead.

Tories will never do this.

Ahh, I understand what you mean, thats what I would be using furlough for this time around if I thought I was in the "waiting room for redundancy" as someone called it.

(R of) Ireland introduced a temporary UBI instead.

Really? Link to more info? You'd think that would have been huge news.

Agree, its a massive factor and optics matter far more than sensible, long-term policies.

A Tory government will never give a decent amount of cold, hard cash to the precariat; wouldn't want them to be financially stable enough to start a business, innovate, etc. now would they?

Pretty odd they’ve not done it sooner. As I said, I understand that here (Luxembourg) we have been doing it for most of the pandemic

Which jobs won't be viable though and how does anyone know at this stage? Many areas are essentially mothballed until we come out of this eg entertainment/leisure/hospitality but will return as a whole (even if individual businesses can't make it through). In retail, many will be able to carry on the online side on fewer staff and then will need furloughed staff to be in place when they can safely reopen.

Making everyone unemployed on a UBI then having to staff up again will take far longer to recover.

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social_welfare/covid19_and_social_welfare.html#

Looks like my mate on Facebook misrepresented it.

So a furlough / top up & generousish Covid unemployment scheme.

Like if you earned over 400 euro a week it's not so great, but 350 a week you still get 300 a week, 200 or less you get 203.

Benefits down south are much more generous. Taxes are higher but not sure low tax / high benefit countries exist?

Universal Credit is so poor many people with mortgages etc. (not the "traditionally poor") and skilled jobs have to go to the foodbank after paying their bills.

working poverty. There's a food bank opposite my flat and every day the queue is a bit longer.

There are earlier articles saying some work has been going on, I think the scale increase is recent though.

I assume the slow UK response will be down to the UK water authorities being private and wouldn't do it off their own back while public health has been rundown to not have capacity for it.

Yep and there is more working poverty than before, it's only gone up the past years.

The attitude towards benefits is really positive at the moment, just after the 2008 crash (when there were no jobs...I don't understand people... 🙄) it was very negative.

Perhaps if Labour gets in 4 years on (if...) they can make amendments if attitudes are still good but big IFs...

You're right, it's impossible to know. But IMO the rigidity of the current furlough system is counterproductive and forces people to be in suspended animation, it gives a false sense of security of things eventually going back to the way they were and for a significant number of jobs that simply won't be the case.

Just popped out in Forest Hill, for my allotted walk (featuring takeaway coffee), and it was identical to yesterday, as was the traffic on the South Circular.

Manchester town centre same as the last few weeks.

All looks the same out the window from the flat I never leave

I've been out of the house three times today, each time doing the same journey, to primary school and back. 8am, 9am and 3.30pm.

Each time I only saw other school parents.

Seems significantly quieter here (Herne Hill) than pre-lockdown.

It's not all bad news.

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