Coffee Appreciation

Hi, I'll take this if it's still available please.

Hi. Great. When do you want to collect? Why not send me a DM and we can sort something out.

I’ve realised my v60 was merely a gateway drug and that now I’m craving something purer and stronger...

I’m the only coffee drinker in my house And work 5 days a week, but I love a nice espresso.

If you were to get a grinder and small machine for this use, what would you get? I’m willing to spend up to about £400, want something easy to maintain, have limited space and hate new-fangled plasticy and touchscreenish designs. Happy to buy second hand too. Any advice much appreciated...

Something like this? Comes with £100 voucher st the
Moment? https://www.thecoffeemate.co.uk/p/coffee-machine-set-lelit-pl41tem-pl043mmi/

Here's my opportunity to promote the Robot.
As the only coffee drinker in house, who wants espresso, has limited space, doesn't want technical complexity and, I'll add, wants some of the best coffee you can get from a simple home machine, it ticks all the boxes.
https://www.cafelatstore.com/products/robotpowdercoating

Buy 200 espressos while you’re out and enjoy delicious hassle free V60 coffee at home 😉

I'd second the Robot, absolutely love mine. You will need to pair it with a good grinder. A Robot and a Niche Zero would be the perfect setup and the only pair (just) under a grand that will get you cafe quality espresso at home.

the only pair (just) under a grand that will get you cafe quality espresso at home.

My Baratza Sette + Europiccola would like a word ;)

Now here's a flame-worthy question... Assuming a halfway decent Espresso machine, how much do you need to spend on a grinder to get better results than by using small bags ground at the local coffee shop, kept in the freezer?

I've been fairly disappointed by home-grinding, but have never used anything near as fancy as that Niche Zero.

I'll bet those can't compete on cost and maintenance though.
The Robot and a good hand grinder are about as close to hassle free as you can get with espresso.

Not that I would ever discount getting a nice electric grinder - how would you compare the Sette to the Niche?

The advantage of getting coffee ground on a commercial grinder like the EK43 (which most coffee shops have) is it's going to produce less fines. I remember hearing the guys in the Cat & Cloud saying they grind a bag in the shop and bring it home because even though the coffee is getting stale it'll produce a better brew because there's less fines then an average home grinder.

For espresso it's different because there's far to many other variables at play. Getting coffee ground in a cafe isn't going to produce the same espresso on your home machine as their commercial machine. The grinds will either choke your machine or give you gushers and as the coffee ages that is going to change.

You need to dial in espresso beans to your machine to get them in the right range and tasting right.

Think cost all in for me was around £700, £350 for each or thereabouts. No idea on the relative maintenance of the Baratza vs the Niche. I imagine the Robot is no more than a few gaskets. Only thing on top of that that I can think of for the Europiccola is the occasional descaling.

Can't really argue with the second point, though hand-grinding for espresso is not something that I'd want to do long term (I only have experience with the Porlex & Rhino, I imagine something like the Rok grinder would be a bit more usable, but also takes up a fair bit of kitchen space. Though I imagine you're pretty happy with the Helor also so I imagine that's also an option)

Honestly I have no idea, both seem to get good reviews and I've not seen a proper comparison. I think the Niche was in it's crowdfunding phase when I was getting the Sette so I didn't have any confidence in it at that point. So throwing some money at Baratza seemed like the better call. I've not yet seen anything about the Niche that convinces me that it's worth the extra £150 (and I tend to avoid new companies for these sorts of things in the event that they go bust and spares are no longer available).

That’s sort of what I thought about the quality of the commercial grind, which was visibly much finer than anything I could produce at at home (as you say).

But take the point about dialling in and ageing... Oh well, may have to start saving the pennies!

It's more of a consistency benefit over absolute particle size. The grinds that come out of an entry-level machine will have a much greater variation in particle size, whereas a higher quality machine will give you a more consistent particle size.

I paid £120 for my used commercial grinder 10 years ago and it's still doing a fine (sorry) job for us
https://thehippy.net/blog/aristarco-ema-75/

Is there anyone on here with coffee knowledge who lives in and around Peckham?

I have a 'Baby Gaggia' machine which seems to work fine but I am struggling to pull a good espresso shot.

I would like to confirm to what extent this is my lack of grinder/good tamper/technique versus the machine.

Would someone (who knows what they are doing) be interested (in exchange for beers) in having a go at pulling a shot? Maybe you could bring your grinder/tamper is this is not too laborious.

Where are the beans from? You said you don't have a grinder.
If you've got pre-ground supermarket stuff then that's probably the first thing to fix.

Yes have been using pre-ground, if that is the issue but the machine works fine then I will buy a grinder, but ideally would like to confirm the machine works before I do.

Buy some beans from your local specialty roasters and ask them to grind them for a Gaggia... That'll probably be the cheapest way to figure out what's going on with your setup...

Cheap first bag from Pact for £2, and they'll grind it for Espresso
https://www.pactcoffee.com/coffee-plans/signup?voucher=NEW

Can you pop into a local coffee shop and ask them to grind it for you? Anderson & Co on Bellenden Rd have a decent setup there so may be able to sell you some freshly ground coffee.

Or video yourself making one and post it on here

If you were to get a grinder and small machine for this use, what would you get? I’m willing to spend up to about £400, want something easy to maintain, have limited space and hate new-fangled plasticy and touchscreenish designs. Happy to buy second hand too. Any advice much appreciated...

@JackSloan Gaggia Classic and Iberital MC2. I've had the Classic over 10 years and it's capable, adjustable and bombproof. I don't have that grinder, but it's the one everyone talks about for espresso at that budget and it's the one I would get if I were to get a grinder. You'll need a 58mm tamper to fit the basket and some scales like the Yagua Barista scales from Yellow Bourbon are helpful.

@mmccarthy @>>>>>> @duncs @Tenderloin

Thanks all, looks like Monmouth in Bermondsey is the nearest roaster so will get some beans and have a go! Also ordering a tamper..