Legal help with ebay cycle related purchase.

So on the 23rd of April I purchased these Vittoria tyres for my Colnago, they were nos, boxed and around 15/20 years old. I fitted them and rode 12 miles according to strava.
Imagine my 'displeasure' when I noticed this...

So obviously after spending £80 on them I started return with a pretty polite message and with these photos attached. I've basically got a reply from him saying tough you didn't read my terms and conditions regarding old vintage stuff... it reads as so....

Hi Shawn,

I always offer returns on unused items but NOS items are sold with the following conditions explained in all of my listings, see below.

Terms and conditions of the sale:

Lucio-Bici does not offer any warranty on vintage NOS (New Old Stock), used or second hand products. Please use at your own risk. We decline liability for any damages or injury resulting from the use of these items, most of which are decades old. Items are sold as seen and described. We strongly suggest customers take additional care with vintage items, and as a result of their age not subject them to too much force when fitting or by subjecting them to "hard" riding. Vintage items described as NOS (new old stock) are new and believed to of never been used or fitted (unless otherwise stated) despite the possibility of having signs of storage.

Surely the sale of goods act, ebay returns and paypal protection overrides his sly get out clause?

Naturally ebay and PayPal help is almost non existent right now although I do a have an ebay returns label to send them back along with the usual 'you should see a refund within 5 days' but I'm concerned if I send them back I will never see them or my money again.

I think I'm being fair after only 12 miles, imagine them in 50 miles!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/353007732464

They don't look like the items in the pictures so yes item not as described and ebay/ PayPal will probably act in your favour. I'd probably still ride them and never entertain buying old shit again thats liable to perish.

To be honest I've bought plenty of nos tyres over the years, sometimes old bmx and mtb tyres far older than these and not had any issues.
I've got back to him and basically said they are not as described and not fit for purpose, he is now seeking assistance from ebay which tells me he is unsure of his owns 'terms and conditions'.

doesn't matter what the seller's conditions are-he agreed to Ebay t&c's before he sold them, and they're the only ones that count. If the item is defective or not as described he has to accept the return.

That's exactly what I thought/hoped, but needed confirmation, I've said to him ebay and paypal (and the sale of goods act 1979) will over ride his shonky get out clause. Sorry terms and conditions....
But he wont have it....

yeah just open a case and let ebay deal with it then. Waste of time trying to argue with someone.

Yes, it appears that way!

Regardless of any t&c, eBay rules or otherwise, I really don't recommend riding on 15 year old tyres.

As I said above, over the years I've had dozens of bikes nearly all 'vintage' and I like to fit them out with as correct parts as I can, including tyres. This is the first issue I've come across when buying nos tyres. For instance right now I have a '94 Cannondale mtb with its original Tioga psycho tyres still fitted, still ragged, still no problems.

My Colnago is a team issue bike, used on the 2001 TDF so finding these correct tyres was initially a great find...

Regardless of any t&c, eBay rules or otherwise, I really don't recommend riding on 15 year old tyres.

Yeah. Especially 20mm! Jeebus

See above ;)

You can't expect all NOS tyres on ther market to have been stocked in a dark, dry place at the correct temperature for 20 years though.

If 26 year old tyres that have been used and abused can be still fine you'd expect that tyres stored boxed for a similar or less time to withstand 12 miles of use yes?

The point is not that though, it was a question about the legalities of a sale.

Thanks for the helpful replies, it appears a firm stance has ended in my favour.

You can't expect all NOS tyres on ther market to have been stocked in a dark, dry place at the correct temperature for 20 years though.

This. They could have been sat onto of a radiator for 20 years.

I was coming down on the seller’s side to be honest but just read the item description and yeah, they have definitely over-promised.

Got a set of 18c that came on a set of wheels, must be about 20+ years old but look dandy.

Tempted to take them out for a spin just to see how ridiculous they are

I never said you shouldn't get a refund.

If 26 year old tyres that have been used and abused can be still fine you'd expect that tyres stored boxed for a similar or less time to withstand 12 miles of use yes?

Well, IME rubber can perish very quickly, so no, I wouldn't assume anything of a 20yo tyre of unknown origin. I hope you find a suitable replacement pair (EDIT: and get a refund, if that wasn't clear enough from the 1st stentence.)

I was coming down on the seller’s side to be honest but just read the item description and yeah, they have definitely over-promised.

I'm in this camp. they described the tyres as 'mint' and 'superb quality', which IMO suggests that they will function as, er, tyres.

Rubber can degrade unseen to the naked eye, the further back you go, the more likely it is to degrade both because it's older and because the rubber tech is older.

If the tyres looked like they did in the pics when they arrived then I'd say the seller has not acted in poor faith, they looked mint and in superb quality. The only way to know they weren't going to fail would be to try them out, which isn't really possible to preserve their unused status.

If you were to argue that the seller should have stated there was a risk they would degrade then you would have to argue that the seller would have to have known about the shelf life of rubber tyres, but then you would also have to concede that as a buyer, you should have also known.

As an example, a friend brought a NOS pair of Vans snow boarding boots on a snow boarding trip. He had bought them after his last trip many years before and just kept them in the box because he had kids not long after and the opportunity to go again hadn't come up for years until this trip.

They looked mint, he brought them in the box, he was very proud of his retro style at the top of the slopes. After his first run, when he took his boot out of the bindings, half the sole on one shoe came apart. Old rubber wasn't meant to last that long, especially not tyres.

Sorry terms and conditions....

The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 mean that he can put whatever he likes in his terms and conditions, but they can't overule your statutory rights set out in the the Consumer Rights Act 2015 (which has replaced the Sale of Goods Act 1979).

So perhaps quote that at him/eBay/PayPal.