EU referendum, brexit and the aftermath

The ref just asked leave or remain...

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I had this same conversation this afternoon.

"Well they are going to find it is just as bad for them as it is us so it's in their interest to renegotiate with us"

And that's from a remainder. Worried about the pound tanking and making the French mortgage on her holiday home more expensive

The 27 other countries are distinctly not dependent on the UK being part of the EU so she, the bar lady, is on a base level wrong. But the 27 other countries are themselves divided with a propensity within themselves, within their domestic politics, to be dissatisfied with the EU. This, no matter where you stand, rightly worries the EU leaders or more precisely the Commission. There is no longer any talk of EU expansion and the eastern countries particularly appear to be moving that way. Which makes no mention of domestic politics in Germany, Holland and elsewhere. Gone are the days of EU conformity , sadly. Its now just negotiation as to what the future looks like and it doesn't, long term, look like the same ol' EU anywhere.

We all live in our own echo chambers, our own little worlds. Some believe remain will win if there's a new ref. Some believe leave would win. The people around both those sets of people reinforce that view.

Polite coherent reasonable discourse is almost impossible with the other side no matter which side you are on. Both think they are right and the other side is wrong. Both get frustrated that the other side doesn't take their concerns seriously.

Our country is divided, broken. Civilisation globally is approaching it's endgame. Our most enlightened phase is truly proving to also be our most brainless.

David Davis thinks that today's vote will convince the EU to renegotiate. Surely the vote is conclusive that the UK government can't deliver anything it promises and isn't worth negotiating with.

In particular the trade deficit with Germany, who people believe control all final decisions on the EU.

The thing is there is some truth to the facts around it. But people construct the question / statement for their own bias, conveniently forgetting about the EU members' trade with the rest of the EU.

Just because it's true that the EU and a large number of individual states will be negatively effected by us leaving, and even more so leaving with no deal ≠ the EU being better off giving us a two-cake deal than no deal.

From it's original inception Britain's relationship with European union has been characterised by arrogance and delusions of grandure. This is the culmination.

It often seems to be based on the fact the UK is UK is either the second or third largest economy in the EU (leavers often say it's the second of course but it depends on the measures used).

But given we're a net importer and all our exports via road have to go via Europe...

A good practical example is food. We grow 61% of the food we eat, but if you look specifically at fruit and veg, there's a huge deficit in fruit and vegetable production. In 2015, imports of fruits to the UK were valued at £3.1 billion; imports of fresh vegetables (excluding potatoes because they're not vegetables they're a carb) at £2.1 billion.

55% of our tomatoes come from the EU - a lot from the Netherlands, which despite being tiny is the second largest exporter of food behind only the U.S. (because they've embraced modern high tech farming methods).

Britain will never be self-sufficient in food production, according to the president of the NFU.

But right, they need us more than we need them...

Ugh.Obviously we'll start growing more to fulfill demand! Then we can give proper jobs to proper English people. We'll just knock down cities to make space.

In time, the famine and homelessness epidemic will solve the issue until we're actually over supplying

Erm
Potatoes aren't vegetables?

Spoken like a true London centric middle class tit.

Gammon gammon gammon

When do you jump in and make an intervention on a relative's Facebook?
Asking for a friend

Middle class potatoes: either sweet potatoes or celeriac.

Actually it's not my delineation when you've finished insulting me! The £2.1 billion figure excludes potatoes as they're not classified as vegetables. Obviously the bit about them being a carb was my addition.

I think that's why this is such a good example, it would of course be possible for the UK to produce more food and this could be one genuine silver lining of Brexit - more locally produced food - but it will take years. And it's not like food is important or anything is it.

Well played The Scotsman.

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You have to jump in with both feet straight away

And 80% of our economy is services anyway. If I were running a European law firm, or consultancy, or IT firm, or financial services I'd be seeing plucky Blighty ruling itself out of competition with me as huge opportunity not a problem.

I imagine the French and Germans will cope with a shortage of cheddar, Marmite and pot noodles.

Although that is admittedly the breakfast of champions.

should be a walk for Remain

Was supposed to be last time

Sorry I was in character.

Eternal optimist.

Why are you still on Facebook? I'd say you might require the intervention.

GPWM.

I like to wind myself up with their commentary.

Go for broke no? Just call Farage a millionare of the people and explode some heads ;)