Car appreciation... the aesthetics, the engineering, etc

There's a good argument for buying FSH Japanese if you want reliability on a second-hand...

Personally I wouldn't touch any of the more low end/ economy models from German manufacturers if that's your priority, they're often little better than disposable as the manufacturers are building them knowing the first owner will only keep it for two years and then buy another one.

As I said it wasn't meant to be a dig. Just pointing out that if you wanted a £60-100k sports car leasing is a strong contender. For a true comparison you also need to factor in what else you could have done with the £20k of capital tied up over those 2.5yrs.

In a way you've been fortunate with the amount of travelling you do as it's made the downtime mostly irrelevant.

Anyway this is the key part;

But I don't (and did not) want a 991.

What's the forum consensus on the new 'subscription' model as an alternative to leasing?

Cluno in Munich for example: https://www.cluno.com/de/

You'd need to do the maths. But it sound good.

I heard of a great one with Peugeot in Paris (I think), where it applied to all vehicles. So you can use a scooter in the week for work, small car for the shops, van to move, convertible for the weekend.

Last time I added it up Zipcar in London worked out cheaper for both me* and my folks.

*when I lived in London.

I used to be a regular ZipCar user.

I'm helping Volvo with their subscription model currently, but it's perhaps tricky as an OEM (versus a third party): https://www.volvocars.com/de/carebyvolvo/

Dare I say, if that deal had still been around when I decided to buy @Dammit 's Volvo, I might be in one of those instead

Its a good car and perfect for my wife but zero driving smiles... you're better off in the R if you're at all interested in actually driving

I meant to have a sensible, leased estate car to go with the silly sports car.

Problem was I didn't want diesel, but I did want lots of torque - which meant electric or a big V8, which ruled out leasing (but if that subscription model had been around, might have enabled a V90 T8), so I bought an old AMG-Mercedes.

Did you just say your Porsche is worth 20,000? I'm constantly looking at cars and edging closer to a Porsche in the next 5 years and I'm surprised to hear that quote. I would have thought two to three times that value.

Not talking about what it's "worth" to you. I fully understand value is sometimes a non-monetary thing and I'm not trying to sound pejorative.

The 996 is the red-headed step-child of the 911 family, so right now it's the cheapest.

It's uncertain whether they'll continue to bump around at that level or go up - the 964 was £15k for ages, now they're £50-70+, but the 996 was built in far greater numbers.

Early Boxster S is the best value Porsche for the money IMO. Pick one up for £5k, yeah friends will laugh for a while but who cares. I took mine down to southern Italy and it was nothing but a pleasure. I got a 986 facelift but keeping an eye out for another early one at the right price, Silver, Amber lights, Red leather. As close to the concept as possible.

my perfect Porsche went on eBay the other week.

Check this out, well worth 3k: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mk1-Caddy-pickup/263943083006?hash=item3d743bd3fe:g:ON8AAOSwBzpbn~J7

MK1 XR2 with 200 miles is at 50k.

Madness.

I'd love to see a good bit of analysis on the reason for all these random non-correlate assets ridiculous growth.

Wine I half get because of the tax perks.

Is it just that there are that many more people now with vast sums of wealth needing to be preserved? And do some of these non-correlate assets end up actually just correlate with each other? (thinking about watches and and cars here)

Vast ammount of money have been printed in the past 10 years and historically low interest rates have meant zero return on savings and cheap credit. All of that money has mostly ended up in bloating assets.

do it rich. those and the 914s are the only Porsche I could ever consider

The hangover from the current insanity promises to be immense - a mate of mine took a look around the warehouse of this place a couple of weeks back. The amount of old 911s they have (not listed on their inventory) is astonishing. 50+ easy. There's places like this all over the US.

https://www.beverlyhillscarclub.com/about-beverly-hills-car-club.htm

I'd think that good examples of all 996's will go up. They'll just increase in different increments. About 8 years ago we had a lovely, low mileage 996 GT2 at my dads place that we were selling for a longstanding customer.. After sitting at 40k in the showroom for 4-5 months, the owner decided to take it back and chop it in for something else. Looking at Pistonheads now, the cheapest (by a long shot) GT2 is now 86k with all the others priced at 120k +...

Beverly Hills CC are famous for air cooled 911’s - usually in need of significant resto, no matter what the advert says. They won’t have paid a lot for their stock, the people who are going to be burned are those that bought a fully restored 1972 oil-flap car for £150,000+

That's perfect, love the seats. I have a soft spot for the hideous maroon colour with uterus purple interior....

Yup - they are as bought, many in need of significant repair; opinion varies on how much they've paid. There seem to be a bunch of classics (maybe old Porsches in particular) that are being hoarded / invested in very significant quantities, BHCC are just one of several in CA that have that sort of inventory, never mind the rest of the country. Like all other fickle, illiquid assets everything will probably be fine as long as prices continue to go up at something juicier than the risk free rate.

Totally agree about the squids paying 150 large.

Brrrr buying from Beverly Hills needs some serious "buyer beware". They sell some real dogs.

I'm spending scary money restoring an early 911. Kind of just accepted their peak price has past and hoping the cost of restoration meets around where it's fall in value stops.
Could have sold it last year for a tidy profit half finished too.

good examples

The all important phrase.

One of the falicies of investing in things like cars, watches, etc. is the notion that you can use them. In reality using them massively increases the risk of damage and huge loss (as well as depreciating them). A colleague has one of the few (8 apparently) UK RHD manual V12 Vantages sitting SORN in his garage because it keeps going up in value and right now he can't afford to risk the loss driving it could cause.

In fairness to the 996 GT2/3's have always been a bit more special and were sold in lower numbers. My gut says 2010 would have been the wrong point to sell that sort of car being both so close to the crash and making it a bit too old, but not yet old enough.