EU referendum, brexit and the aftermath

Kate Body now on the brink of deselection, Frank Field to follow. Meanwhile...

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Clear EU scaremongering there ...

By which date do I need to have moved next to a Belgian monastery in order to avoid the impact of Brexshit?

What's stopping the UK recognising EU based professional qualifications, even if not reciprocated?

Because Gammon's wouldn't like it..they need us, more than we need them etc

What's stopping the UK recognising EU based professional qualifications, even if not reciprocated?

Legislation, at a guess - and also that we'd be giving away any negotiation capital if we did so and they did not. Not saying that the EU would not reciprocate, but if you were a student looking at where to do their veterinary studies and if you did them in France they were recognised in the EU and the UK, or the UK and they'd be recognised in the UK, where would you go?

It refers there to vets signing off exported meat and similar I think.

So we'd recognise EU qualifications in our Vets, allowing EU vets to work in this country, on behalf of the UK govt in signing off animals.

When you came to export that meat, the EU would be given a signoff by a UK registered vet (albeit one originally trained in the EU). They don't recognise UK registered vets, so that meat registration is unrecognised.

Something like that perhaps?

As a member of the EU we can certify our own production - from farm through slaughterhouse to export, as we are in the same regulatory framework.

Once we leave, we can't - hence checks need to be done as our meat is the same as any third countries.

Yes I understand that, but the concept that there would be carnage at borders due to food coming into the country, seems to be overstated.

At the moment, food comes into the country fine because it's been produced in the EU and therefore conforms to EU regulations for food manufacturing.

If we leave the EU it doesn't stop us saying, "EU food can enter without checks".

That doesn't address the potential cost increase, but honestly, what is stopping us writing a law that comes into affect the day we BREXIT (if we do), that says anything that comes in from the EU conforms to our own standards?

So bleak it's almost reassuring ... surely letting that happen is more likely political suicide than calling it off/diluting it til it works?

Nothing.

But expect corners to be cut then, cos that's just how things roll, you can't assume that all EU vendors will be honest if there is no EU whip to keep them in line.

"hey people we are seeing weird stuff with some EU food"
"Talk to the hand, not our problem anymore"

As above, we import 60% of our food? We can keep doing that unhindered by anything other than price.

Current situation:
UK Border: Is your food produced to EU standard?
Manufacturer: Yes it is
UK Border: Great, come on in because that's fine with us

Why do we need to change that?

If we leave the EU it doesn't stop us saying, "EU food can enter without checks".

Is that the bit that's referred to here in the article:

But this approach would have profound consequences. Overnight, there would be no protections whatsoever for UK consumers on the food they eat.

This would be a betrayal of ministers' assurances of high food standards after Brexit, but put aside the morality and think about the practicality. Opening the border in this way would provide an open invitation for fraudsters. They could send anything to the UK they like - any food product, any drink, with any ingredient - knowing there would be no checks. The spot check system operating under EU law would vanish. There would be no documentation, no safeguards, no court oversight, and no supervision.

The UK would be instantly downgraded to pariah status by the EU and the rest of our trading partners. British food exports would shrivel up.

So food manufacturers are going to go through the trouble of setting up a 2nd production line to produce food to a lower standard that they can get away with selling to the UK but not any EU countries?

I'm not sure I understand this, if I choose to buy USDA certified meat, I don't have to be part of the USA to know that it's been checked and certified to USDA standards.

Food manufacturers have a client (right word?) who buys 60% of their requirements from them, and now they can get away with removing all the expensive bits from their manufacturing process?

I'd imagine they'd at least explorer taking advantage of it...

But then they can't label it EU compliant.

What's stopping me saying, "I want to buy EU compliant food"?

Yes, sorry. I realised after I wrote it that you were referring to allowing in food that had legit EU standard papers. I guess it's in the 'fraudster' bit in that paragraph - if it's not going to be checked, or not checked very rigorously, maybe that's an invitation to them?

I don't really know. I'm absolutely not an expert on this, just internet riff'ing.

Then it would be defrauding the EU, and we might not be members of the EU but we can still whistleblow(?)

I get that, I'm not trying to be annoying, but I think I'm just been getting more and more frustrated by the complete lack of pragmatism from either side. Leave can't say anything other than "The will of the people" and "MA SOVRENTY", and Remain can't say anything other than "IT WILL BE THE END OF WORLDS"

I get that, I'm not trying to be annoying

No, of course. I don't really know; maybe once your food system becomes compromised (e.g. you don't check your cattle food properly anymore, as you let anything in that claims to be from the EU without checking) then that has further knock on effects (e.g. people won't want to buy your cows from you either?).

Personally, I'm more inclined to believe articles like the one posted than any from the leave side, as I've not seen any articles similarly detailed of what will happen given the benefits of the leave side.

Yeah I do agree that Remain articles are taking the time to hypothesise what the expected effects will be and how it all might play out.

I think I'm just fed up of it all and I want to go live in a little utopia with all of my lefty liberal remainer snowflake friends and erase all knowledge of the shit in the world.

what is stopping us writing a law that comes into affect the day we BREXIT (if we do), that says anything that comes in from the EU conforms to our own standards?

One of the legal obstacles is the WTO. @JWestland is wrong to say that nothing is stopping us. If we just give a green light to all EU food checks, we're violating WTO rules on trade without discrimination, by giving special favours to the EU as a trading partner. We'd have to blindly accept all food certifications from all nations, no matter how bad, to get away with it.

One practical obstacle is the logjam at the borders, which would not be cleared by making it easier for some EU goods to get in. If getting back out is slow, even when the trucks are empty, who wants to send their trucks in?

We're part of a network. Trucks come here, drop stuff off, pick other stuff up, head on. We're breaking that network. As a result, traffic in both directions dries up.

Ups, of course :)

Then we better not get a WTO brexit.

Maybe not, but it would not surprise me if it would be an interesting area for fraud. Remember the horse meat scandal?

Gove, Fox, and many others were part of the discredited and dis-banded Atlantic Bridge, 'charity'.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2011/oct/15/liam-fox-atlantic-bridge

Their intent was, and clearly remains to ditch the EU standards for food, food production and animal welfare standards to allow US manufacturers free access to the UK market. The US has some obvious areas where the EU standards are clearly different, and higher than the US;
gmo feedstuffs are routine in US livestock production, and food production,
most US milk is from gene-modified cattle,
the oft-invoked 'chlorine washed' chicken.

If at Brexit+1 minute, DExEU introduces legislation to 'copy'n'paste' EU Food Regulations,
the Atlanticists and their backers cannot start importing US food,
and,
the UK will be subject to legislation, ultimately enforced by the ECJ, that we have no part in writing, (='vassalage' J Rees Mogg, '= satrapy' A dePfeffel), one of TMay's Lancaster House speech Red Lines.

I'm also fairly certain that the UK arbitrarily adopting EU Food regulations goes against the indissolubility of the EU's Four Freedoms,
unless specifically negotiated and agreed by the EU27.

It means that our agricultural sector would be finished, I suspect - the Americans can farm at much lower cost as they have much lower standards/use hormones and antibiotics to make up for welfare issues/put on mass fast. With nothing to stop them selling into the UK market out farmers would be priced out. Their choice would be to move to the US farming model, writing off any sales to the EU and sell exclusively to the UK, or go bust.